30th Sept Release Date [Archive] - Halflife2.net Forums

k956764

05-09-2003, 02:38 PM

It may just be me but 99% of all game releases that I can recall have been on Fridays. I know with a Worldwide release there is going to be some day variation but a game coming out on a Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday or even Thursday (I know no where will be on Thursday daytime) seems strange. I really really do hope they make the 30th but with the days I would envisage a Oct 3rd to hit UK shops (Or if miracles did happen then 26th Sept) I always get depressed as more and more places quote November release (I think Amazon UK is one of the few with a Sept 30th date) Anyway I will put my trust in Gabe and hope that the 30th holds true (Wouldn't be surprised if you can't get the game in shops on 30th but can via Steam :) )

Quotidian---

05-09-2003, 02:42 PM

lets just say it would be very very bad marketing for them to wait to announce a delay... the sooner a delay announced in my opinion, the less impact and rage you get/recieve.

scribblehead

05-09-2003, 02:43 PM

oh no....you said release, now you're gonna get it...

I will put my trust in Gabe and hope that the 30th holds true

Umm as far as i know vavle stated that a september 30th still stands

lets just say it would be very very bad marketing for them to wait to announce a delay... the sooner a delay announced in my opinion, the less impact and rage you get/recieve.

Agreed, it would be definate suicide to release a delay statement 25 days before its release...

k956764

05-09-2003, 02:47 PM

Does anyone have a good idea (Read Accurate Idea) on the MINIMUM amount of time it would take from a game going GOLD to getting in the shops? Just thought that would give everyone a earlier date on which they will know for sure if the game will make the 30th. My guess and please note it is just a guess would be about 2 weeks (That is going to be some very fast CD pressing for the number that will be required :) ) which would indicate that HL2 would need to go GOLD before Tue 16th Sept (1 week from next Tuesday)

k956764

05-09-2003, 02:52 PM

Ooops apologies all for using the word 'release' I know the feeling of waiting for the game of the decade / century etc......

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 02:53 PM

All release dates are tuesdays. That's just how it works. The reasons for it are logistical (y'know...shipping...setting up displays...making sure all stores get it out on shelves at the same time.)

Double click your clock in the bottom corner...bring up the calendar, and go look up as many release dates as you can. DVD's, CD's, games...all release on tuesday. "OWN IT ON DVD THIS TUESDAY" says it in every DVD/video commercial on tv :P

Even those little-known walmarts in the middle of nowhere get their shipments of new stuff out on shelves on Tuesdays.
I'm just assuming, but i think it's because this way they can ship things days in advance and make sure the vast majority of stores get things at different times, but all put them out on shelves the same day. It's also so stores can have a set schedule. This way they can have extra employees or whatever they need so they can stock shelves overnight or however it is they do it.

Anyway, the november release shift could just be a policy of some of these online stores to change their release dates if a game hasn't gone gold XX days before it's projected release. Who knows...we'll just have to wait and see if there's some official announcement.

scribblehead

05-09-2003, 02:55 PM

well another thread indicated that HL1 went gold the 7th of november and was in stores the 11th november...i'd say thats pretty quick.

My *estimate* would be that it probably goes gold between the 15th and the 25th

dis

05-09-2003, 03:07 PM

Originally posted by Quotidian---
lets just say it would be very very bad marketing for them to wait to announce a delay... the sooner a delay announced in my opinion, the less impact and rage you get/recieve.

I would be extremely surprised if there was a delay at this point. If there was one, it would imply to me that they knew they weren't going to finish by Sept. 30 but chose to tell us that they would. With less than 30 days left, that would imply that they either lied or were that clueless about what was left to be done. I would hope a professional company would not have either of these occur. If they wait till a week before and announce a release, a lot of people would be disappointed with the apparent deception, and a good chunk of people would be outright pissed. Of course, final problems with development could occur, but they're probably not too common in the last 30 days. You'd end up with a lot of people going ape shit claiming they wouldn't buy the game now, etc., etc. Other people still claim it won't be coming out on Sept. 30, e.g. Fragmaster at PlantHalfLife.com, but I just can't see two HL employees (one of them the PR/Marketing dude) confirming that it's still coming on Sept 30 with 35 or so days till that release date and then the game being delayed. If it does happen it'll suck, but I guess we'll just have to wait.

k956764

05-09-2003, 03:14 PM

Please excuse my mindless excitement but one interesting aspect I have thought about is linking Worldwide release with (For the first time I believe) Internet download via Steam. Now looking at 30th Sept 9am GMT release if they were going with EST (Not sure what Time Zone they would use) this would place the game in UK shops before Steam (9am EST is 2pm GMT) now if dreams really came true they would use Nuku'alofa which is 13 hours ahead and thus give us access to HL2 via Steam from 8pm GMT on 29th Sept :)

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 03:20 PM

Originally posted by k956764
Does anyone have a good idea (Read Accurate Idea) on the MINIMUM amount of time it would take from a game going GOLD to getting in the shops? Just thought that would give everyone a earlier date on which they will know for sure if the game will make the 30th. My guess and please note it is just a guess would be about 2 weeks (That is going to be some very fast CD pressing for the number that will be required :) ) which would indicate that HL2 would need to go GOLD before Tue 16th Sept (1 week from next Tuesday)

Epic accomplished mass distribution in 7 days from going "Gold" with UT2003. I have my suspicions that it took a Holy Miracle to do this, but they managed it nonetheless. SoF2 was in stores about 12 days after going gold.

I think it's really up to the publisher with regard to how much they want to spend during the initial replication process. My GUESS (yes you freaking 14 year olds out there, I said GUESS) is that it costs x amount of dollars to guarantee y replications.... 2x for 2y replications, and so-on. I have no doubt that they can't possible fill the initial demand for HL2, and the only people who will have an actual CD/DVD in their hands come 9/30 will be those with pre-orders. Anyone else who MUST have it on 9/30 will be forced to get it via Steam.

Personally, I'm really torn. I'm one of those "I can't wait another damned second", and must have it immediately... but I don't want to place a pre-order given that no retailers have any idea what to make of the HL2 SKU situation. I want the Collector's Edition, but I'm not going to plunk down for a pre-order if I don't know which I'm pre-ordering in the first place.

Oh well.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 03:22 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
All release dates are tuesdays. That's just how it works.

That's only for music and movies, and is a function of the recording industries rules. This doesn't apply to every piece of media that happens to be on CD or DVD... ie, GAMES.

dis

05-09-2003, 03:28 PM

I don't think I'm going to have a problem picking up a store copy without a pre-order come Sept 30, or whenever it gets released. Only us hardcore fans are anxiously watching the release date and will be running to the store to get it on the day of release. My brother loves the game and still plays CS a lot, but he didn't even know the release till I told him a week ago. I bought GTA Vice City the first week it came out without a pre-order, and I got a GameBoy Advance SP the first week without a pre-order. If you show up to the store on the day of release it'll be easy to get a copy. They don't make the entire first shipment for pre-orders. That's part of the reason I stopped pre-ordering. First, I got tired of having to wait for those f$@# nuts at stores to call me to pick it up, and second, you can sometimes get it more quickly just by running(not literally) to the store on the release date because if your pre-order doesn't make the first shipment then you have to wait, but I'm pretty sure that they don't make the entire first shipment reserve only - at least all stores don't. Plus, I don't think Valve is going to advertise (cuz they won't need to in the end), and so I don't think there's going to be a huge rush to buy the game (at least not like the rushes that occur when I new console system comes out)

MoJo|Night

05-09-2003, 03:41 PM

"All release dates are tuesdays. That's just how it works. The reasons for it are logistical (y'know...shipping...setting up displays...making sure all stores get it out on shelves at the same time.) "

Maybe in the US but in the UK games are Friday's and movies and music are Monday's. Always have been.

Phreakly

05-09-2003, 03:50 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
That's only for music and movies, and is a function of the recording industries rules. This doesn't apply to every piece of media that happens to be on CD or DVD... ie, GAMES.

Sadly, you are mistaken, go to ebgames.com and take a look, all new game releases are on Tuesdays. Tuesday is the entertainment industry standard release day.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 03:53 PM

books also come out on tuesdays...it's just major releases from major companies...i guess i didn't make that clear...that i meant only major game releases and just about every release for other media types.

That's only for music and movies, and is a function of the recording industries rules

actually it's a function of sales tracking software...tuesday is just the standard day large companies use as a marker for their sales data.

Vivendi universal (who owns Blizzard and Sierra...not to mention universal studios) also owns the universal music group...so vivendi-owned companies release on tuesday to conform with their parent company's sales/marketing practices.

I guess i was too hasty when i wrote my first post. I didn't allow for exceptions at all...which is wrong. however, the basic point of my post was to point out that a tuesday release for a game isn't "weird" as k956764 was saying.

your own sentence didn't make sense anyway "a function of the recording industries"
you just said it's only movies and music...when did the music recording industry start making movies? obviously it involves more than one industry....and more than one reason. It's also helpful to stores, as i pointed out. They can plan when they are going to be receiving shipments of new merchandise and plan accordingly...rather than receive things at random.

and thanks for capitalizing "GAMES" i wasn't sure if you were trying to make me out to be an idiot or not...now i see you were trying to be condecending.

-------------

if you're from the UK, you should realize you're buying a game from an american company and that the release date posted on american sites will be the american release date, not necessarily the "in stores date" for the UK.

regardless, valve has stated that the worldwide release date will be the 30th...so that "should" mean that hl2 should ship around the world before that tuesday...and then all the stores will put the game out at the same time.

unless they're referring to the steam release when they say "worldwide" maybe the boxes won't be on UK shelves until the friday after the 30th

:P

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 04:11 PM

Originally posted by Phreakly
Sadly, you are mistaken, go to ebgames.com and take a look, all new game releases are on Tuesdays. Tuesday is the entertainment industry standard release day.

That's funny... because UT2003 was released on a Saturday (of all days), and I picked up SoF2 the day it was released... on Thursday.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 04:16 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
actually it's a function of sales tracking software...tuesday is just the standard day large companies use as a marker for their sales data.

This just simply isn't true at all. I worked at a record store for four years, and we routinely got merchandise in as much as a week before we were LEGALLY allowed to release it. If we released a record (CD) before the industry-wide release date, we'd get SUED (and did - twice). It has nothing to do with tracking software at all (not sure where you got that)... in fact, when these large companies are sitting on hundreds of copies of a really hot item, they'd love nothing more than to get it to the shelves before their competition... but because not every retailer receives said merchandise at the same time, the music industry has regulated the release of the product. Call your local Sam Goody or whatever, and they'll tell you this. They hate it.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 04:26 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
This just simply isn't true at all. I worked at a record store for four years, and we routinely got merchandise in as much as a week before we were LEGALLY allowed to release it. If we released a record (CD) before the industry-wide release date, we'd get SUED (and did - twice). It has nothing to do with tracking software at all (not sure where you got that)... in fact, when these large companies are sitting on hundreds of copies of a really hot item, they'd love nothing more than to get it to the shelves before their competition... but because not every retailer receives said merchandise at the same time, the music industry has regulated the release of the product. Call your local Sam Goody or whatever, and they'll tell you this. They hate it.

you missed the point. it's to track sales data. you just said you're not allowed to release a CD before the standard release date. exactly, man...you can't sell anything before the date because they want to track the sales (For the billboard charts, etc) of COURSE every merchant gets the CDs on different days. they're in different places!! the warehouses that ship the CDs are in certain places and then they ship all the little cds out in the little trucks that drive to the stores around the country and deliver them.

all the stores get their items at different times, but (hopefully) all before the standard release date.

where in the quote you chose from my post did i say anything about releasing items before the release date? um i didn't.

Dagobert

05-09-2003, 04:28 PM

on the MINIMUM amount of time it would take from a game going GOLD to getting in the shops? EA can do it in two weeks. That's very very fast.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 04:36 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
That's funny... because UT2003 was released on a Saturday (of all days), and I picked up SoF2 the day it was released... on Thursday.

read my post about vivendi please...

thing is...not even vivendi releases ALL their games on tuesday...only the major ones that they want to track sales on. i.e. warcraftIII battle chest is supposed to come out on a friday.

my whole post started as trying to tell the original starter of this thread that it wasn't weird for a game to come out on tuesday. you've turned it into an "i'm smarter than you" thread...which is just wrong.

http://www.avault.com/previews/

you can see here that not all the release dates are tuesdays. however, all the major titles fall on tuesdays...as well as microsoft releases, and major vivendi releases.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 04:39 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
you missed the point. it's to track sales data. you just said you're not allowed to release a CD before the standard release date. exactly, man...you can't sell anything before the date because they want to track the sales (For the billboard charts, etc) of COURSE every merchant gets the CDs on different days. they're in different places!! the warehouses that ship the CDs are in certain places and then they ship all the little cds out in the little trucks that drive to the stores around the country and deliver them.

all the stores get their items at different times, but (hopefully) all before the standard release date.

where in the quote you chose from my post did i say anything about releasing items before the release date? um i didn't.

Actually bro, YOU missed the point.

it's to track sales data

What in the world makes you think a company needs to standardize a specific day to release a specific TYPE of product in order to accurately track their sales? That's a ludicrous notion, no matter how you look at it...

exactly, man...you can't sell anything before the date because they want to track the sales

I've already explained why release dates for CD's are what they are. I know this because I was in the middle of two lawsuits dealing with this very topic, and am well aware of the logistics and reasoning behind it. If you simply chose to ignore that, then there's nothing I can do about it.

they're in different places!! the warehouses that ship the CDs are in certain places and then they ship all the little cds out in the little trucks that drive to the stores around the country and deliver them.

Thank you, Captain Obvious. I'm glad you cleared that up for all of us.

where in the quote you chose from my post did i say anything about releasing items before the release date?

And where in MY post did you see me say you said anything about this? I merely said that I've bought games on days other than your magical Tuesday. I'm sorry I have to spell this out for you, but I was illustrating a simple point (or at least, I thought it was simple) that the "Tuesday release" is something that is strictly adhered to for music releases, NOT games releases. How do you explain UT2003's release on a Saturday (at EB Games, btw), and SoF2's release on a Thursday? Instead of talking about sales tracking software that you've never seen, how about you address those two examples I've given you?

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 04:44 PM

ANYWAY... moving right along...

If they go gold by September 15th (and I recall reading somewhere that was their target), they can hit the September 30th release date. Now, as for the actual availability of the game (how many copies will be available), that remains to be seen.

Going back to UT2003, I remember how frustrated a lot of people were that they couldn't get their hands on it. Stores were selling out of it the moment they opened and/or received their shipments. A big problem, in my opinion, is employees taking first stabs at the stock. I didn't actually pre-order UT2003, but I asked them when they got their shipments in. I got their about a half hour before it arrived, and by time they allocated the pre-orders and bought copies for themselves, friends, etc, there were 3 copies left (of which I managed to grap one).

Regardless of the post-release success of UT2003, one has to agree that it was one of the most anticipated titles we've seen, and demand was through the roof.

I can see HL2 being in even more demand, thus creating an even more difficult time to get your hands on it. I really wish that Valve/Sierra/Vivendi would settle on a production strategy (SKU's, etc) and communicate it to the retailers ASAP so we can accurately place pre-orders.
JMHO.

Joneleth

05-09-2003, 05:05 PM

It's entirely possible that Valve is working as hard as possible on the game... Maybe they don't know they'll need a delay quite yet.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 05:07 PM

when these large companies are sitting on hundreds of copies of a really hot item, they'd love nothing more than to get it to the shelves before their competition

that's where in your post i got that you were trying to say something about releasing before the release date.
=====================================

and i already addressed SOF2 and UT2k3 by saying that i realize that not all games come out on the same day....several times...and i've repeatedly stated that my first post was wrong in not leaving room for other release dates for games.

but i'm still right that all the major games get released on tuesday. console and PC. Madden 2004, HL2, Halo....as well as books such as harry potter, and video rental stores put their new videos out on tuesday.

here's the sales tracking software, mr know it all:
http://www.soundscan.com/about.html
ever heard of nielsen ratings?
there's also bookscan and videoscan.

Anything released on Tuesday takes advantage of a whole week of ales, to better their ranking on the charts the following Wednesday.

games sales charts are made via different sources, the main one being called NPD, but operate under much the same principles as the "scan" ones.

this doesn't affect games as much because not as many people pay attention to the game sales charts as do the billboard music charts....hence games don't all come out on tuesday since not as many peole care...like i said i already know that...even though you seem to want to smash into my brain what is already there.

I'm sorry I have to spell this out for you, but I was illustrating a simple point (or at least, I thought it was simple) that the "Tuesday release" is something that is strictly adhered to for music releases, NOT games releases.

right, i've already established that it's not "strictly adhered" to music releases and that i understand that games aren't strictly released on tuesdays...so you're wasting your time "spelling it out" because i already know that...and have stated that i know it.

futhermore, statistically, tuesday used to be the least profitable day of the week, and it was started as a way to get customers into the stores on "off" days

so yes, in fact "my magical tuesday" is magical after all.

just because you got sued for releasing things early or whatever doesn't mean anything...yes it means you have experience, but you've already been shown that you don't know everything
i already admitted i don't know everything...whereas you're pretty damn arrogant.

Mountain Man

05-09-2003, 05:10 PM

Fortunately, I live in a small town, so new releases are almost always available off the shelf on release day, so I usually don't pre-order. However, with a game as big as Half-Life 2, I'm not taking any chances. If the gold date gets pushed, the distributor may only have time to make enough copies to fulfill pre-orders and maybe a few extra copies per store for retail stock, but I have a feeling Half-Life 2 is going to be one of those titles that flies off the shelves and sells out in short order.

05-09-2003, 05:12 PM

Originally posted by k956764
It may just be me but 99% of all game releases that I can recall have been on Fridays.
Definately just you. Its always Tuesdays and Wednesday, with the occasional Thursday round here.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 05:12 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
blah

Well, now that you've made half a dozen concessions/exceptions on/for your original claims, then I don't disagree with you nearly as much. If you had stated as much earlier on rather than making crazy blanket statements, then we wouldn't have needed this discussion.

And yes, I'm arrogant. It's one of my "quirks".

So like I said a moment ago: ANYWAY....

Goombatommy

05-09-2003, 05:27 PM

Yea, but here's the funny thing about UT2K3. UT2K3 was unlike other games, it was VERY VERY VERY highly anticipated....I mean their was even an article on CNN saying the reason why the internet was so slow was because of bandwith loss on the entire Eastern US's was because of the UT2K3 demo release. The ACTUAL release date was supposed to be that following Monday or Tuesday I believe. But somehow it managed to get on store shelves in places like EBX, Gamestop, etc. etc. on Saturday evening (I bought it Sat. evening). So, in theory, UT2K3 went gold, packed and shipped, and managed to get onto store shelves in 4 - 5 days. Not saying this is going to happen with Half Life 2, but hey, who knows......it would be a charm if Half Life 2 appeared on store shelves a day or two or three before Sept. 30th.

EDIT: Best Buy refused to put it on their store shelves until that following Monday I believe.

05-09-2003, 05:28 PM

Goombatommy

05-09-2003, 05:30 PM

Yea lol those things were pretty crappy. Nevertheless, the first I think 100,000 copies came with a totally bright orange manual booklet lol. Then they started shipping traditional black print w/grey pages.

05-09-2003, 05:31 PM

Yup I preordered, got the shitty cd sleeves, the god awful orange manual, played the game for a week, then traded it back in to EB ;)

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 05:32 PM

Originally posted by Goombatommy
Yea, but here's the funny thing about UT2K3. UT2K3 was unlike other games, it was VERY VERY VERY highly anticipated....I mean their was even an article on CNN saying the reason why the internet was so slow was because of bandwith loss on the entire Eastern US's was because of the UT2K3 demo release. The ACTUAL release date was supposed to be that following Monday or Tuesday I believe. But somehow it managed to get on store shelves in places like EBX, Gamestop, etc. etc. on Saturday evening (I bought it Sat. evening). So, in theory, UT2K3 went gold, packed and shipped, and managed to get onto store shelves in 4 - 5 days. Not saying this is going to happen with Half Life 2, but hey, who knows......it would be a charm if Half Life 2 appeared on store shelves a day or two or three before Sept. 30th.

EDIT: Best Buy refused to put it on their store shelves until that following Monday I believe.

Yeah, their time from gold to release was pretty remarkable. As for UT2003's anticipation, I agree that it was "very very very highly anticipated", but I also feel that HL2 will actually be even more anticipated. It's been featured several times on CNN's Technology corner, and it's even received other mainstream press attention because of its surprise smackdown at E3. It's also my opinion that HL2, on a fundamental level, appeals to a broader range of gamers than UT2003 does/did. I guess I just see HL2 doing what UT2003 did and then some (the main difference being that people will still be playing HL2 after the first week ;) ).

Goombatommy

05-09-2003, 05:36 PM

Yea, I agree with ya their. The entire Half Life universe has generated more publicity on itself, and if you look at the stats, more people STILL play Half Life and its mods (CS, TF, etc. etc.), than any other game - even Quake 3. Surprisingly, RTCW dominates UT2K3.

But back to topic, I'd rather them take their time, and release it on Sept. 30th, rather than rushing it and having some "oopsies" like they did with UT2K3's orange manuals.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 05:47 PM

Originally posted by Goombatommy
Yea, I agree with ya their. The entire Half Life universe has generated more publicity on itself, and if you look at the stats, more people STILL play Half Life and its mods (CS, TF, etc. etc.), than any other game - even Quake 3. Surprisingly, RTCW dominates UT2K3.

<Thread-Hijacking>
Yeah, I'm surprised at the success of RtCW, to be honest. I tried it, and it was interesting, but how many freaking WWII games do we need? It amazes me how well they sell, especially the better ones. WWII has been done to death (then reincarnated itself, only to be done to death again). But, it obviously did something right (I'm just not sure what, TBH).

What happened with UT2003 is very unfortunate, and I actually feel pretty bad for the developers over at Epic. From a technical standpoint, I think the game is a technological marvel, and it's absolutely stunning to look at it. They worked their ASSES off on the game, and they tried to do some new and interesting things with gameplay, and it just simply didn't work. They obviously knew they couldn't just rehash UT, but at the same time, couldn't alienate the UT fanbase. That's a pretty shitty spot to be in, if you ask me, and probably a no-win-situation, regardless of how you look at it.

Me personally, I'm craving present-time military FPS's. Not the Rainbow-Six level realism (or UbiSoft's hack programming), but rather a modern-day Counter-Strike (sorry guys). Soldier of Fortune II was a step forward for me, but with the Source engine and a game like HL2 to build upon, I can only imagine the type of gameplay and graphics that could be created. Urban-style present-time combat with a totally interactive environment with widespread physics is an extremely exciting scenario for me.
</Thread-Hijacking>

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 05:47 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
Well, now that you've made half a dozen concessions/exceptions on/for your original claims, then I don't disagree with you nearly as much. If you had stated as much earlier on rather than making crazy blanket statements, then we wouldn't have needed this discussion.

And yes, I'm arrogant. It's one of my "quirks".

So like I said a moment ago: ANYWAY....

wow, i pointed out that i wasn't the only one making "crazy blanket" statements. as you did when you said that the tuesday thing strictly applies to the recording industry only...

and where you made fun of me for suggesting that companies would want to track their sales. (who ever heard of such a thing!?!?):

This just simply isn't true at all. I worked at a record store for four years, and we routinely got merchandise in as much as a week before we were LEGALLY allowed to release it. It has nothing to do with tracking software at all (not sure where you got that)... in fact, when these large companies are sitting on hundreds of copies of a really hot item, they'd love nothing more than to get it to the shelves before their competition... but because not every retailer receives said merchandise at the same time, the music industry has regulated the release of the product.

for one, you re-stated what i said...i already posted about how retailers get their shipments ahead of time but have a standard release date...i was telling the original thread starter that...then you proceeded to tell me that like i didn't already know.

also:
"this simply isn't true at all"
like i said:
http://www.soundscan.com/about/

go ahead and make your "i'm right, now let's move on...thanks for making concessions so i can look good" statement.
but if you're not an asshole you'll say "yes i guess i didn't know about the sales tracking thing (insert other non-asshole statements here)...you'll feel much better when you stop trying to be right all the time...it's something hopefully all will learn as they become adults...it should be trying to find the truth...not "i'm right and better than you"

05-09-2003, 05:49 PM

^
i didnt read any of that

Mountain Man

05-09-2003, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
And yes, I'm arrogant. It's one of my "quirks".
Sounds more like a character flaw.

Goombatommy

05-09-2003, 05:53 PM

Yea, I am too starting to get sick of the WWII shooters....CoD is it, I draw the line their lol. Battlefield : Vietnam looks pretty interesting.

I as well feel bad for Epic , I mean, I dont know if you remember CliffCam, but what it was, it was a webcam in CliffyB's office, and it was up 24/7 even when the place was closed for the nite. But towards it's gold date, you saw them up for like the last 2 weeks playtesting I presume. I personally like UT2K3. It's a visual treat, nevertheless it kicks ass in surround sound ;). Im now looking forward to games like Far Cry, BF : Vietnam, HL 2 (duh), STALKER, etc. etc.

dis

05-09-2003, 06:00 PM

I still don't think HL2 is going tp "fly off shelves" at least in the first day. Most of the mainstream public and general gamers won't even know it's out until a few days later. Valve is probably not going to need to advertise, but I bet 90% of gamers don't even know that HL2 is supposed to come out at the end of this month. And with the release date quickly approaching, I don't think any mags/websites are going to get to review this baby before it gets released to the public. Sure all the pre-orders are going to be gone fast, but I think copies on shelves will be available somewhat easily. This release date is coming up so fast with very little info on the game that I think it's gonna be released before the vast majority of people have a clue. At least here in Memphis, I'm confident that I'll be able to find a copy on the release day without a pre-order. Memphis isn't a small town (1.5 million), but it's not New York either. And with all this confusion over different versions (SP only, SP+MP, and SP+MP Collector's Edition), I'm glad I haven't pre-ordered; how'd you know which one you'll get?

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:01 PM

Originally posted by Mountain Man
Sounds more like a character flaw.

I didn't say it was a good quirk ;) .

Originally posted by Bass

^
i didnt read any of that

Me either. I did see the word "asshole" somewhere in there though while I was scrolling the page. I should apologize to him that he hasn't found my personality to his satisfaction, but fortunately, I can live with that, so I probably won't do the "I'm sorry" thing.

EDIT: Fixed misquote from Mountain Man

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by Mountain Man
Sounds more like a character flaw.

lol yes...i was going to say the same thing.

and Bass, thanks for letting us know what you read and don't read...i couldn't care less if you read it :\

i'm not out to impress everyone with my writing/debate/anything else skills.

just trying to make an arrogant ass realize he doesn't know everything...which i think i did. if he doesn't agree...well....he's an arrogant ass.

I should apologize to him that he hasn't found my personality to his satisfaction, but fortunately, I can live with that, so I probably won't do the "I'm sorry" thing

see..that's the problem. you can live with yourself being an arrogant ass, but the problem is the rest of us have to live with it too :\

it's ok if you don't like admitting being wrong...you still are :\

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:08 PM

Originally posted by dis
I still don't think HL2 is going tp "fly off shelves" at least in the first day. Most of the mainstream public and general gamers won't even know it's out until a few days later. Valve is probably not going to need to advertise, but I bet 90% of gamers don't even know that HL2 is supposed to come out at the end of this month. And with the release date quickly approaching, I don't think any mags/websites are going to get to review this baby before it gets released to the public. Sure all the pre-orders are going to be gone fast, but I think copies on shelves will be available somewhat easily. This release date is coming up so fast with very little info on the game that I think it's gonna be released before the vast majority of people have a clue. At least here in Memphis, I'm confident that I'll be able to find a copy on the release day without a pre-order. Memphis isn't a small town (1.5 million), but it's not New York either. And with all this confusion over different versions (SP only, SP+MP, and SP+MP Collector's Edition), I'm glad I haven't pre-ordered; how'd you know which one you'll get?

You make some good points, but I guess I'm just caught up in what I saw with UT2003. There was a big stock shortage here... now, whether that's a result of low production rates or high demand, I'm not sure.

You're definately right about the pre-order situation: I'm not pre-ordering jack until I know what exactly it is that I'm pre-ordering. I'm inclined to just settle on grabbing it via Steam, but like many others, I enjoy having the box/manual/etc in my hot little hands.

Originally posted by dis

Yea, I am too starting to get sick of the WWII shooters....CoD is it, I draw the line their lol. Battlefield : Vietnam looks pretty interesting.

I as well feel bad for Epic , I mean, I dont know if you remember CliffCam, but what it was, it was a webcam in CliffyB's office, and it was up 24/7 even when the place was closed for the nite. But towards it's gold date, you saw them up for like the last 2 weeks playtesting I presume. I personally like UT2K3. It's a visual treat, nevertheless it kicks ass in surround sound . Im now looking forward to games like Far Cry, BF : Vietnam, HL 2 (duh), STALKER, etc. etc.

Yeah, I remember the webcam - those guys looked like CRAP during those last few weeks of development and testing. They obviously sacrificed quite a bit. I totally agree that it's a fun game, but there just aren't enough people playing online to find any good games (and the few servers that are populated are running LG/IG). I'm definately looking forward to STALKER. I don't know much about the game TBH, but from what I've seen (and heard about its story), it's definately going to be intriguing.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
more blah

Dude, speaking of "being adults", do you know how to let things go? How about you go start a new thread about our discussion, and you can sit there and argue with yourself about it. Everybody wins.

05-09-2003, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy

I'm definately looking forward to STALKER. I don't know much about the game TBH, but from what I've seen (and heard about its story), it's definately going to be intriguing.

Its my 2nd most anticipated game. Its not your typical FPS thats for sure. Theres very few enemies, theres a trading system involved, and theres more exploration oriented than the typical FPS fare.

Goombatommy

05-09-2003, 06:12 PM

From what I heard, STALKER is gonna be more exploration, compared to "run with a gun" shooting action> I mean, the developers from I heard, mapped out Chenobryl EXACTLY as it was in real life, and put it in the game. It's more exploration, government conspiracies and cover-ups, etc. stuff like that.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by Bass
Its my 2nd most anticipated game. Its not your typical FPS thats for sure. Theres very few enemies, theres a trading system involved, and theres more exploration oriented than the typical FPS fare.

EXACTLY - and that's something that really hasn't been done before. It's like Everquest/EVE meets Devastation (except a good version of Devastation that doesn't blow your machine up when you install it and laugh at you when you try to play MP).

05-09-2003, 06:13 PM

Haha you should have read my post first ;)

edit: @ goomba

05-09-2003, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
EXACTLY - and that's something that really hasn't been done before. It's like Everquest/EVE meets Devastation (except a good version of Devastation that doesn't blow your machine up when you install it and laugh at you when you try to play MP).
Well I wouldnt say it hasnt been done before, but I WOULD say its pretty much the SECOND time its been done, Metroid Prime on the Gamecube being the first

Goombatommy

05-09-2003, 06:14 PM

lol sorry.....Im sick and my vision is kinda screwed up at the moment, I apologize :cheers:

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by Bass
Well I wouldnt say it hasnt been done before, but I WOULD say its pretty much the SECOND time its been done, Metroid Prime on the Gamecube being the first

Just because I'm too lazy to go see for myself, what's the ETA on STALKER at the moment? It seems like I hear a little bit about it every few months, but that's been going on for about a year.

05-09-2003, 06:18 PM

2004 is all thats known. Id bet 3rd quarter though, think its still a ways off. But thats just my opinion.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
Dude, speaking of "being adults", do you know how to let things go? How about you go start a new thread about our discussion, and you can sit there and argue with yourself about it. Everybody wins.

that's standard operation for arrogant people

as soon as you show everyone they're wrong they tell you you're being childish and you should drop it :\

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:24 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
that's standard operation for arrogant people

as soon as you show everyone they're wrong they tell you you're being childish and you should drop it :\

Or maybe that they got bored and found something more interesting to talk about, while having the pleasure of sitting back watching you twitch over the fact that no one really gives a **** anymore.

JMO

Mountain Man

05-09-2003, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
I didn't say it was a good quirk ;) .
Well, at least you're honest. I have to admire that.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 06:26 PM

You make some good points, but I guess I'm just caught up in what I saw with UT2003. There was a big stock shortage here... now, whether that's a result of low production rates or high demand, I'm not sure.

i don't think the same thing will happen with hl2...though i fear it just like you.

ut2k3 was developed by a canadian company in league with epic. i think vivendi has much greater resources to make enough copies and such...it's not like they don't know hl2's potential :P

You're definately right about the pre-order situation: I'm not pre-ordering jack until I know what exactly it is that I'm pre-ordering. I'm inclined to just settle on grabbing it via Steam, but like many others, I enjoy having the box/manual/etc in my hot little hands.

agreed as well...this "multiple versions" thing has me thinking.
in that recent email about the multiple versions thing, valve said they were gonna sell the single player only version at the walmart's of the world and sell the "mod/multiplayer" version at the ebx's of the world

not everyone has an ebx or a credit card to get the version they want then :\

MrD

05-09-2003, 06:28 PM

rofl @ Maskirovka & JavaGuy

Mountain Man

05-09-2003, 06:30 PM

My pre-order cost was around $50 or so. It sure as hell better not be the discounted single player version at that price!

droper

05-09-2003, 06:31 PM

They are in final test(tweak and tweak some more till date) people So it can be gold already or it will be realease VERY VERY close to original date. If they are having serious errors or problems they would have changed the date already. They obviously think that they can make it happen. Honestly i think steam will be the bottleneck.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:32 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka

agreed as well...this "multiple versions" thing has me thinking.
in that recent email about the multiple versions thing, valve said they were gonna sell the single player only version at the walmart's of the world and sell the "mod/multiplayer" version at the ebx's of the world

not everyone has an ebx or a credit card to get the version they want then :\

One promising thing I've heard regarding Steam is that Erik Johnson was talking with someone about why they'd prefer to purchase a physical copy of the game rather than through Steam, and they (predictably) replied that they wanted to have the "proof of ownership", and the novelty of the box and its contents. Erik replied "I thought so" and said that they'd consider some options to help entice people to purchase it via Steam.

I for one would certainly pay full retail price to get it via Steam if it meant that a hardcopy product would be sent to me in the meantime. In fact, I'd probably even pay a few extra bucks just for the convenience of "playing it now, getting it later". This solves the distribution and pre-order issues because those of us who are obsessive about getting it on day one (no pun intended) don't need to worry about availability, OR the issue of "okay, which one am I on record for?".

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by Mountain Man
My pre-order cost was around $50 or so. It sure as hell better not be the discounted single player version at that price!

That's probably a pretty safe assumption, but I think the main concern is over whether that $50 gets you the standard-issue SP+MP, or the Collector's Edition. On top of that, what format? Is it DVD or CD format? There's so many SKUs for this that pre-ordering is a tough move to make at this point.

dis

05-09-2003, 06:44 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
One promising thing I've heard regarding Steam is that Erik Johnson was talking with someone about why they'd prefer to purchase a physical copy of the game rather than through Steam, and they (predictably) replied that they wanted to have the "proof of ownership", and the novelty of the box and its contents. Erik replied "I thought so" and said that they'd consider some options to help entice people to purchase it via Steam.

I for one would certainly pay full retail price to get it via Steam if it meant that a hardcopy product would be sent to me in the meantime. In fact, I'd probably even pay a few extra bucks just for the convenience of "playing it now, getting it later". This solves the distribution and pre-order issues because those of us who are obsessive about getting it on day one (no pun intended) don't need to worry about availability, OR the issue of "okay, which one am I on record for?".

That would make me more likely to purchase it over steam, but I just don't like the idea of downloading levels while I'm playing previous ones. I've been having trouble with my RoadRunner cabel modem recently. Ever since those damn worms went around, my ping in CS and BF1942 has been between good and downright shitty, so I don't want to trust it to downloading levels correctly. What would happen if I outright lost my internet connection down the road for some reason and couldn't get the next level. Talk about suckin' a phatty :/

Edit: The only reason I would buy HL2 over Steam is if you get to download either the whole game at once or an install file that contains the whole game. yeah, it'd be massive, but I want to have control over the singleplayer portion on my harddrive.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
I'd probably even pay a few extra bucks just for the convenience of "playing it now, getting it later". This solves the distribution and pre-order issues because those of us who are obsessive about getting it on day one (no pun intended) don't need to worry about availability, OR the issue of "okay, which one am I on record for?".

yea, i'd pay a few extra bucks to "get it now" as well. I just worry about the smoothness of all that. DL speeds, server busy, file sizes...corrupt files because of multiple download resumes, etc.

i hope they have all that figured out already :P

i just hope more game developers start pushing steam-like distribution systems. If it gets used the system(s) will get improved and it'll be better for everyone. It lets game companies have more freedom with release dates, patches, content, etc. no vivendi or whatever company breathing down their necks about this or that.

plus, i'd like my money to go to VALVE, not some company that owns a bunch of other companies :\

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 06:47 PM

Originally posted by dis
What would happen if I outright lost my internet connection down the road for some reason and couldn't get the next level. Talk about suckin' a phatty :/

lol

is that really how steam works though? i haven't really read up on it, but does it really download the next level as you're playing the current one? that would be shitty and unreliable i'd think...just as you pointed out :P

dis

05-09-2003, 06:50 PM

Originally posted by Maskirovka
lol

is that really how steam works though? i haven't really read up on it, but does it really download the next level as you're playing the current one? that would be shitty and unreliable i'd think...just as you pointed out :P

Well, I don't know to be honest, and I don't think anyone besides Valve does know right now. I think a lot of us have simply assumed that that's how it would work. I can't imagine that it would download the entire game, but maybe it does. It's just that that's how HL1 on steam works to the best of my knowledge; it downloads the levels as you play through the game.

JavaGuy

05-09-2003, 07:11 PM

First let me state that a) I think Steam is a GREAT concept, and b) I've only been using it for about a week.

That said, one thing that I particularly don't care for is how little control you have with regard to how it operates. For instance, Dis brought up map downloads. It would be great if you could pop open steam, select a game title, and then be directed to a "catalogue" of assets for that particular game (ie, maps, skins, models, etc). Then, you could selectively choose which ones to download, AND TO WHAT LOCATION. The download should default to the proper directory (ie, if you're downloading a map manually like this, then it will default to the HL2 map directory).

I think a system with options like this would take Steam to the next level.

One other thing that had me puzzled: I own Half-Life, but didn't have it installed on my PC. I downloaded/installed Steam, and clicked on "Counter-Strike". It downloaded the whole thing, and then fired it right up (didn't even need my CD key). What was weird was that there was no actual installation process (at least not that I was aware of) for the game. The usual file system is there - it's as if the game was installed from CD - but I certainly didn't see any of that happen when it brought down CS.

Anyway, I got a bit off subject. IMO, this is what I'd like to see for Steam and HL2:

1. You purchase HL2 over Steam and download an installer. This installer downloads HL2 and installs it on your machine (in Steam's case, it may actually act as the installer, and does from what I can gather).

2. When you make the purchase, you specify what edition of the game your purchasing (ie, Collector's Edition).

3. You chose what format you'd like to receive the game in (CD, DVD).

4. You chose any additional items you'd like to purchase (Strategy Books, Mod Dev book, Making of HL2 book, etc)

5. You select your shipping method for the hardcopy, with UPS Ground (or similar) being the default.

By doing this, you give customers the game IMMEDIATELY, but they also easily acquire whichever version they want AND they receive the actual box in the format they desire. This also makes the publisher happy, because they're not being cut out of the loop.

You could easily charge the retail price for each of these versions, or even spike it a few bucks (but certainly not more than 5USD).

dis

05-09-2003, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by JavaGuy

Anyway, I got a bit off subject. IMO, this is what I'd like to see for Steam and HL2:

1. You purchase HL2 over Steam and download an installer. This installer downloads HL2 and installs it on your machine (in Steam's case, it may actually act as the installer, and does from what I can gather).

2. When you make the purchase, you specify what edition of the game your purchasing (ie, Collector's Edition).

3. You chose what format you'd like to receive the game in (CD, DVD).

4. You chose any additional items you'd like to purchase (Strategy Books, Mod Dev book, Making of HL2 book, etc)

5. You select your shipping method for the hardcopy, with UPS Ground (or similar) being the default.

By doing this, you give customers the game IMMEDIATELY, but they also easily acquire whichever version they want AND they receive the actual box in the format they desire. This also makes the publisher happy, because they're not being cut out of the loop.

You could easily charge the retail price for each of these versions, or even spike it a few bucks (but certainly not more than 5USD).

If they did it like that then it would be awesome! Especially, like the idea about the installer. If I can simply get the complete game installed at once through Steam, then I would definitely consider doing it this way. Especially if you can get the manual, cd/dvd, etc. mailed to you later. But then again, I would probably only do this if I can't find a copy at the store.

OCybrManO

05-09-2003, 07:25 PM

I do like that idea but I'm pretty sure someone mentioned something to Gabe about that (not exactly the same thing but close) and he said they would look into it.

The reason you didn't need your CD Key for the beta of Steam is that no one did... you can play any of the games/mods they have listed for free while Steam is in beta. Though, it won't be that way once Steam is a finished product.

Maskirovka

05-09-2003, 11:14 PM

From planethalflife.com...posted yesterday.

============================================
GNS Project (http://www.gnsproject.com/news/840/) received (from Gabe Newell) another piece of info regarding the different Half-Life 2 SKU’s. This quote explains it all:

For people who buy the less expensive version, they can always upgrade to MOD and multiplayer using Steam.
The price difference will be about the difference there was between the two versions.
The theory is that it helps out retailers like Walmart who have very broad reach into customer bases that don't
care about multiplayer and who are very price conscious. Rather than having to wait a year for the product price
to come down, there's a special version for them on day one.
============================================

upgradability for the "low end" versions...cool

OCybrManO

05-09-2003, 11:16 PM

... already posted many times on this forum by other people who also thought it was cool.

05-09-2003, 11:30 PM

Originally posted by k956764
It may just be me but 99% of all game releases that I can recall have been on Fridays. I know with a Worldwide release there is going to be some day variation but a game coming out on a Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday or even Thursday (I know no where will be on Thursday daytime) seems strange. I really really do hope they make the 30th but with the days I would envisage a Oct 3rd to hit UK shops (Or if miracles did happen then 26th Sept) I always get depressed as more and more places quote November release (I think Amazon UK is one of the few with a Sept 30th date) Anyway I will put my trust in Gabe and hope that the 30th holds true (Wouldn't be surprised if you can't get the game in shops on 30th but can via Steam :) )

Warcraft 3 came out on wednesday last year and frozen throne came out tuesday this year.

Julez

06-09-2003, 03:22 AM

Hey, I've been reading these boards for a while, never registered till now.

Just curious...can someone help me out and what exactly does the "gold date" mean.

Is it a certain number of pre-order copies that has to be filled into order to ship.

If a company does not meet a gold date(ie. HL2 not on Sept. 15) does that mean it gets pushed back.

Sorry if this seems dumb, but plz help me out. thnx

Xtasy0

06-09-2003, 03:25 AM

Originally posted by Julez
Hey, I've been reading these boards for a while, never registered till now.

Just curious...can someone help me out and what exactly does the "gold date" mean.

Is it a certain number of pre-order copies that has to be filled into order to ship.

If a company does not meet a gold date(ie. HL2 not on Sept. 15) does that mean it gets pushed back.

Sorry if this seems dumb, but plz help me out. thnx

a game "goes gold" when the code is finished, when they feel they have a product they can ship, it's called going gold because the game is usually burned to a gold master disc which is shipped off to be mass produced.

Quotidian---

06-09-2003, 03:30 AM

thanks xtasy i knew the general idea of what going gold meant, but i thought it was more along the lines of why things go plantium and silver and what not.... ty.

Dr. Freeman

06-09-2003, 06:07 AM

Originally posted by JavaGuy
That's probably a pretty safe assumption, but I think the main concern is over whether that $50 gets you the standard-issue SP+MP, or the Collector's Edition. On top of that, what format? Is it DVD or CD format? There's so many SKUs for this that pre-ordering is a tough move to make at this point.

when i went to pre-order my copy of HL2, i asked the sales guys at CompuCentre about the situation with collectors edition.

i asked what versions are saved for the pple that pre-order and his answer was

"the customers that pre-order get to decide which version they want, we save enough copies for our pre-order customers"

so.. if there is a special/collector's edition whenever the game is released, then im getting it..

that means

me = worry free :) :thumbs: