Keep or remove shield in CS:S?

[Snakebyte]

What would you guys think if we gave the shield the boot?

Cliffe
VALVe
Seems like a good poll topic to me. :)
Surprised there isn't one already.

[Play4Fun]

I think it should be like this :
1) Keep shield and make it more balanced
2) Remove shield and make some 1.5 fans happy :)

[flo_Orian]

I could think of some adjustments for the shield to make it fit better in the game, but it still wouldnt belong to cs. [x] Remove.

[o3jox]

I think shields will probably still there but not used to much, as drivable vehicles such as tanks and apcs will provide enough cover.

[coleslawjoe]

Take out shield and bring in Manipulator!

You can use barrels as shields :D

[Soundwave]

Keep it in. If it bothers people that much, there's plenty of servers that don't allow it.

[fuzzy_aus]

zactly, might as well have it as a server choice.

[Cole]

Why not like the guy who hosts the server decide what guns can and cant be used?
Thereby its up to the host for any gun to be used\not used
I dont c why not?

[Shuzer]

Keep the shield! Source is BOUND to have better hit detection methods than the HL engine.. fix the bugs, better hitboxes and tada, you have a perfectly functional, balanced piece of metal

[Hazar]

remove it if it looks so bad.

Keep it if you make it like a true shield and have it totally clear.

[Venger]

No Shuzer you are wrong, the shield takes alot of the speed out of the game, if its to be interesting for spectators we should not do that. Even if the hitbox is perfectly correct the shield blocks a huge part of the body forcing an enemy to come close and try to walk passed the shield. Thus using a shield to camp/block passages leads to extremely annoying and unrealistic situations. Remove the shield.

[Shuzer]

No Shuzer you are wrong, the shield takes alot of the speed out of the game, if its to be interesting for spectators we should not do that. Even if the hitbox is perfectly correct the shield blocks a huge part of the body forcing an enemy to come close and try to walk passed the shield. Thus using a shield to camp/block passages leads to extremely annoying and unrealistic situations. Remove the shield.

Never once had a problem killing people with shields, as they're at an extreme disadvantage if you're any good..
Really, not many people use shields, and those that do are usually newbies. I still see no problem with it.

By the way, I'm not "wrong," as my opinion is my own. Thanks for trying to be the authoritative figure, but you're wrong.

BTW, CS lost all its "speed" through the various updates. 1.6 is as slow as a slug, and it's no longer the speedy game it once was.

[Venger]

Never once had a problem killing people with shields, as they're at an extreme disadvantage if you're any good..
Really, not many people use shields, and those that do are usually newbies. I still see no problem with it.

By the way, I'm not "wrong," as my opinion is my own. Thanks for trying to be the authoritative figure, but you're wrong.

BTW, CS lost all its "speed" through the various updates. 1.6 is as slow as a slug, and it's no longer the speedy game it once was.

Actually you are, now you may not have a problem with the everyday pub noobs using a shield to see how it works (because your such a GREAT csplayer), but consider the shield in tournaments, consider SK|SpawN holding a deagle and a shield, and even though whatever team they're playing has 5 Ak's he can drop his guard for a sec and HS them in an instant. Its overpowered and boring.

BTW: Your opinion can be and is wrong, just because its your "own" doesn't make it right. If it was my opinion that 2+2=10 then I would still be wrong.
And just so is the shield not balanced with correct hitboxes.

BTW#2: Just because its been slowed down by some updates doesn't mean we have to put it to a standstill.

[Shuzer]

Venger, I never said I was a "GREAT cs player," as you put it. Besides, I don't play in CAL anymore. I don't give a goddamn crap about it these days, as it's just a bunch of elitist jackasses. Such is why I quit CAL.

Anyhow, past that, if CAL doesn't like something, CAL doesn't need to use it. Just because CAL doesn't want it, doesn't mean it shouldn't be in CS. That's ridiculous.

Alot of VALVe's fanbase (most) are players playing for fun, not competitively. I see no reason why my opinion should be wrong for that very reason.


Edit: I take back part of my first statement. I have respect for cal-i players, but in my experience, m and im are absolute morons who think they rule the world. (I'm not saying this is you, but a certain amount of them...)

[Venger]

Last time I checked SK|SpawN didn't play CAL, but thats beside the point. Also what I said had nothing to do with what a tournament "wanted" it had to do with what the shield causes, in matches and in pubs. And that is a low gamespeed, and annoying situations.

Your opinion isn't wrong because most players aren't playing competitively.
Your opinion is wrong because you say fixing hitboxes and bugs will make the shield balanced, and it wont.

[Shuzer]

Last time I checked SK|SpawN didn't play CAL, but thats beside the point. Also what I said had nothing to do with what a tournament "wanted" it had to do with what the shield causes, in matches and in pubs. And that is a low gamespeed, and annoying situations.

Your opinion isn't wrong because most players aren't playing competitively.
Your opinion is wrong because you say fixing hitboxes and bugs will make the shield balanced, and it wont.

Give Ts shield, and it'll be balanced ;)

Either way, I think there needs to be some median found.. I agree it's an advantage, but I'm sure it can be fixed
I just don't believe removal is the answer

[Shuzer]

Thinking on the shield issue, if you couldn't hold a weapon period while holding a shield, that might be semi decent. You can still have a pistol, just not use it until you drop the shield..

thoughts? Maybe I'm crazy, but it almost seems like a plausible solution

Edit: I know all of you are like "omg this d00d n00b cuz he wuntz shield~" but, sometimes it's fun to use simply to piss people off.. or take a break from actually trying, the same gameplay sometimes gets a bit meh after awhile. And I'm no longer dedicated enough to play competitively

[Venger]

I think that'll still leave you with some guy sitting behind his shield while another with an ak empties 3 clips on it while trying to get close. The shield guy will just be walking backwards and causing another one of what I previously described as "an annoying situation" for everyone who is already dead and whoever is trying to kill that damn noob with the shield :P. Also a 2 man team with one shield would still be nearly unkillable given the right position (ie infront of the T doors leading to aztec bsa, one with awp behind the shield and one of the ridges, shooting through a small gap the shield leaves with the wall).

[Shuzer]

Yeah.. I'll admit that shield can definitely be annoying as crap in the right hands.. but I just don't want to see it go, as it's nice to have the option, you know?

[OCybrManO]

Also a 2 man team with one shield would still be nearly unkillable given the right position (ie infront of the T doors leading to aztec bsa, one with awp behind the shield and one of the ridges, shooting through a small gap the shield leaves with the wall).Fighting shields requires you to think a bit more (a quality not typical of the average CS player). If they block that path you take another path and flank them or try to lure them into a trap. I would still like to see the Ts get some sore of special anti-shield measure, but even if they didn't I would want the shield to remain in the game (perhaps with some tweaking).

[Shuzer]

I want the molotov cocktail promised for the Ts! lol, on a completely unrelated note.. ;)

[OCybrManO]

I want a homemade flamethrower in CS!

[tUrbulenz]

OMG go back to your public servers... remove the shield!

[Shuzer]

OMG go back to your public servers... remove the shield!

Thanks for the input. :|

Constructive posts are the best.

[Venger]

I'm finding it funny how everyone is trying to lecture me on "how to fight a shield" when i've played this game since beta 7 and can easily tell you that the stupid thing is overpowered, especially in the art of annoyance. Now while your genious mind may be able to find another path, this shield guy also has a mind and he has a shield, and seeing as how a shield is overpowered, you are screwed.

PS. The molotov is available in the form of a HE nade.

[Shuzer]

I'm finding it funny how everyone is trying to lecture me on "how to fight a shield" when i've played this game since beta 7 and can easily tell you that the stupid thing is overpowered, especially in the art of annoyance. Now while your genious mind may be able to find another path, this shield guy also has a mind and he has a shield, and seeing as how a shield is overpowered, you are screwed.

PS. The molotov is available in the form of a HE nade.

Bah, molotov's supposed to light people on fire.. not blow them up ;)

Anyhow, I have the same feeling. I've been playing since 1.0 (played all the betas too though, just not when they were the current versions), and whenever I defend the shield, everyone jumps on the "you're a n00b" band wagon. I don't agree with the shield as it is, but I believe there's hope for it.. I'm quite optimistic about such things ;)

BTW, I may have been a bit too emotional/angry in my original responses to you, Venger. You seem like a nice guy, sorry :cheers:
Be nice to play a game of CS with you one day, as I respect a vet who's not an asshole or above others (as almost everyone I've ever talked to who thinks they're "good" at CS.. )

[Venger]

It'd be my pleasure :)
And its ok, wouldn't have been able to express my feelings concerning this matter if you hadn't disagreed with me.

[Tr0n]

Get rid of shield.

[simps-chan]

Removing the shield will be the best for the eSports scenario, since no championship in the world allow the use of the shield now, I belive it wouldn't be wise to keep the shield. Because since it's being improved they might allow it... Changing the whole idea of the game.

Just not smart to keep it.
I would remove it from 1.6 as well on the next steam update

[Farfege]

I say if they give Ts a flamin' cocktail, I'd be all good. It would be so sweet to have a CT flaming and dropping the shield in pain. Ahh CS Source will be o so sweet...

[Shuzer]

Another thought, if FBs made CTs drop the shield, that'd be.. interesting

[OCybrManO]

I'm finding it funny how everyone is trying to lecture me on "how to fight a shield" when i've played this game since beta 7 and can easily tell you that the stupid thing is overpowered, especially in the art of annoyance. Now while your genious mind may be able to find another path, this shield guy also has a mind and he has a shield, and seeing as how a shield is overpowered, you are screwed.

PS. The molotov is available in the form of a HE nade.
I'm finding it funny that people think playing since beta 7 makes them special. I started messing around with CS during the original beta when the total population of CS players was probably below 500... but that doesn't make me special. It has no bearing on things that occur dozens of versions later.

Shields may be good against one person at a time, but a shield is almost useless when facing several enemies since they will tend to split up and attack you from more places than the shield can defend at one time (or when you open the shield to attack one of them when he/she runs out of ammo another one could kill you). The more people that are in the game the less useful a shield becomes (except maybe in maps that have a choke point in one hallway with no alternatives, but that is the level designer's fault).

Also, I never said I thought the shield was perfectly balanced. I said they either need to add a good counter-measure to the shield or make it less powerful. If they can't get it balanced just right they should just let servers have the option of turning it on or off. There isn't a good reason to completely remove it if it's already in the game and lots of people (maybe not the majority, but lots of people nonetheless) like it.

PS: There are two major differences between an HE grenade and a molotov cocktail. 1) A molotov cocktail ignites on impact while a grenade is timed. In many cases, with a grenade, that gives your target enough time to get away and avoid a really damaging hit unless you can somehow suprise them. 2) A molotov cocktail can also make a small barrier of fire and/or catch the enemy on fire.

[Dr. Freeman]

Keep the shield! Source is BOUND to have better hit detection methods than the HL engine.. fix the bugs, better hitboxes and tada, you have a perfectly functional, balanced piece of metal

agreed :)

u know.. i never understood the shield whiners.
i mean if u hate it, don't play the game or whatever..
if it bothers u that much.. maybe use one urself and annoy the heck out of other whiners.

there is a place for the shield in the game.. and i hope it stays :p

[omilo]

The majority of CS players dont use it, so you may just remove it...
The shield is just to big of an advantage against a AK or AWP or whatever...
If you gonna keep it, atleast make it weaker, an awp should be able to shoot trough it..
Its also lame that you can knife trough it, but if you spray 30 bullets with an AK47 it make 0 damage....WTF is that BS?

[sk4r]

remove shield = the most dumb thing ever in cs, shield its just for stupid nubs, that dont want really play, they just want to survive and piss off all on the server

maybe if u will make it penetrable, but unpenetrable its just gay thing to bother peoples that wanna play and dont want watching some invincible asshole

[fuzzy_aus]

maybe if u will make it penetrable, but unpenetrable its just gay thing to bother peoples that wanna play and dont want watching some invincible asshole

lol, that would really defeat the purpose of the "shield". If they can do it and do it well, then might as well keep it in.

[Inferus]

I play from the UK, and was refered to this site by www.ukterrorist.com.
The ENTIRE community there, thinks that the shield is utter shite, and shouldn't even be in counterstrike and this is the view i also share.
This community is the leading UK players speaking, so they know what they're talking about.

Do the right thing, and remove it plz.

[mvp]

I second that Inferus :cheese:

I don't know a single member on UKT that doesn't despise the shield. I'm just glad that Valve are giving us the opportunity to vote on it!

[TMPer Tantrum]

Keep the shield but make it penetratable by the higher powered guns. Also allow hits on unprotected parts (sides, the feet) to cause damage.

[Play4Fun]

Bahhh... I think the shield will stay.. look at the votes :\

[Daveh]

Ok stripping the shield down for you guys here is why it's bad.

From a Competetive Play perspective...
It gives a MASSIVE advantage to CTs. Imgine 5 players with shields. Unhittable with any gun. Pro gamers or decent gamers that have pistol aim that is second to none. They just have to sit there and stop the Ts coming close, and if they see an oppertunity, easy kill followed by instant protection from anyone trying to shoot back at you. Silly? I'd say so.

From a Public Play / Fun Play perspective...
Again same reasons as above, you can be almost un-killable, and combined shielders will always win provided its not a 24 man game or anything silly.

Think about new players, why give them an easy option to save themselves from getting killed over and over? They'll get bored faster as they're not exploring the game to it's fullest.

If you want CS:S to be a success you need to remove the shield because the games public play will flop. Competetive players (which are actually the backbone of your community, moreso in Europe i think though) will play public a lot when the game is released. If you have people running around with shields they'll soon get bored with the game and it'll cause a chain reaction causing the game to die.

Oh and to those who say they've never had a problem killing someone with a shield...
Try killing 5 people with shields who wont make a mistake and leave an opening. sorry but people saying that are trying to sound like they're "so good" and hold an invalid opinion.


If you MUSThave the shield... haver a server command to allow or disallow it being bought. This'll at least give a mix of public servers, and i'm actually willing to beat money that the No-Shield servers will outway the Shield servers. And no... people don't want to decrease the performance of their servers by running 3rd party server mods such as AMX to restrict weapons.


Note to VALVe: Forum posters on sites like this DO NOT represent your community mostly. Why do you keep basing what people want on peoples oppinions on such forums? That's not a good way to get in touch with your community. Be more selective.

On a side note to finish of my rant... VALVe charges cyber cafes licence fees (which very vey few other companies do) for it's Steam platform games. The players playing there are 99% of the time competetive players. yet VALVe still makes changes to the game that go against these players wishes, but dare continue to charge stupid license fees? Wake up please you're killing your own game!

People who disagree say what you will... As far as I care you're opinions are based on nothing. Thnx.

GL with HL2/CS:S/DOD:S VALVe and HF.

[redngd]

:cheers: " the shield can impede completely the positive gunning of any weapon in addition to hand thunder;From but make own a square( is usually CT square) of the shield can make use of the shield covers to push forward forward courageously but need not worry to suffer the disservice".This is the main reason that large player in now request cancel the shield.
The emergence of the shield broke originally possessed of aggression with equilibrium that defend, whether reserved the shield in CS1.6 with will soon the HL2 of a life time to arise in large player warmly of discussion, is to go to is to keep in mind to see different.
I have played in our country admission use the server of the shield for a period of time, met 3 persons on the usage in shield:
Category 1 is in spite of to all use at any time the shield is pure" shield fan", certainly this share the minority only;Category 2 casts aside the person of the shield completely, this type of person occupies the majority;Category 3 is that kind of speculation numerator, picked up the shield protection the oneself at the time of having no money, once the opportunity appear to throw down right away the shield makes change the rifle —— Among them more connect the shield to all loathe to give up to buy but picked up the shield to the person who wait for an opportunity.-_-......
From this, the shield is not very popular but too not has no market completely;How to make the esse of the shield broken the match a key problem for last equilibrium large player considering not to the extent of;Pass by with the other player a period of time of exchanges plus realize ownly, I want to follow the related design say my own viewpoint.
Request the noise of shouting that cancel the shield recently first gradually high, cancel the shield doubtless is tournament mode that a kind of choice, this also will be made at the same time the CS maintains the tradition.
If reserve the shield, I want to put forward below what time opinion:
Aim at the shield oneself first, should be further to increase the price of the shield can't make main tool for it to be used as square ECO in CT;
The protection of the shield should change from original completely resist to the part resists, making its at have the weapon that wear deeply the function shoots the bottom can still produce result but an effect for can resisting first part of disservice, this making shield can useding for defering the other party taking the offensive with prolonging user existing time, weakenning its conduct and actions bunker.Although the most people call the " flameproof shield" to it in reality the flameproof ability of the shield is very bad but the bullet-proof ability is top-grade, the total meaning is a suggestion design enhance its flameproof function but lower the bullet-proof function.Let again us say the person who take the shield, shield the oneself is to has no a feet of, join a" flameproof mode" in here me thought only of to took it everywhere ask for is person to living not made a little stipulation, at enter CS empress of purchase column, this mode can allow to enter that appearance at money player of attaining the flameproof mode request and spend him a part of moneys, enter the player a Human body for can purchasing revolver, shield with related and subsidiary product, other gun all prohibitting purchasing, and holding shield top of that mode can't hold the revolver unless he throw the shield away;Player that own the " flameproof mode" will own automatically 100 ammor without helmet , under the situation of hasing no gun can ten rise shield;
The shield of the relief protection appearance holds will be similar to suffer the whole disservice;That mode two squares all have.
Enter the " flameproof mode" for the common personnel who do not choose he won't can purchase the shield, and under any appearance can't ten rise shield;As if similar in merchandise in " flameproof mode" can at purchase the area choice enter, fore a the bureau chooses member of team of the " flameproof mode" if sacrifice, when the next bureau starts return to the common appearance;Own the " flameproof mode" continuously in the next bureau if its survive,,, this time he can choose to own that mode continuously to also can purchase at this square the area choice relief" flameproof mode" returns to the common appearance, the process of the relief since do not increase the money and also does not deduct the money.
If if this bureau breaks, the owner returns to the common appearance.
The organizer of the game can limit member of team who attend the game according to the concrete circumstance whether can use the " flameproof mode".
Say so much in fact is to added into a" flameproof mode".
Opposite in complete cancel shield this how much seem to be to have a little the complicacy, ising not have so a famous saying:" exsit of is reasonable".
I think that the design of HL that shield is also a crystallize strenuous efforts, do since an it does not let why it live of a little bit better.:D
This be worker who my individual's a little viewpoint for shield design project, hope for anything of help in HL with inspire,thanks very much for let me speaking!:D :cat:

[b0sH]

The shield in itself is to open for abuse, people are able to back themselves into impenetrable corners where the only method of reaching them is to boost one man on top of anothers head and while thats happening it is far too easy to pistol them down.

If your of the opinion that the shield should be a server controlled option then why not have a similar option for the awp quick switch, another change that has had much criticism and has taken much of the skill away from the weapon. No longer shall we see the likes of shaGuar + walle unzooming that last man in a desperate last ditch attempt at glory, sad that something like that has been taken away, one of the more exciting aspects of watching CS.

[Gunner]

You people are from CSN right? welcome :)

[Mayhem]

Keep the shield, I'm sure the new engine will be able to sort out the bugs and surely with the new engine people will be able to shoot any limbs that are on show, feet, arms etc which will mean that they can still take damage.

Just as long as snipers can't still get a kill by shooting a shielder in the foot with an AWM :/
That would be stupid.

I think people need to realise that we're talking about CS:Source and not 1.6. It makes a huge difference. Maybe we should take a look at the NEW version of game and use the shields for a while before we just dismiss it.

I've never had a problem killing shielders and I've also used shields in situations like running through the house in Italy only to see a sniper waiting for you as you come out the other side. Is it really fair to die from one shot like that?

Valve could still remove it in the future if the community still can't learn to adapt.

[RNENATOR]

Keep the shield but make it penetratable by the higher powered guns. Also allow hits on unprotected parts (sides, the feet) to cause damage.

If the source engine is so good that the shield doesn't cover unprotected parts (as it does now!) they could keep it. But in my personal opinion please remove, its such a lame projectile. I mean why do you think none of the competetive players ever use the shield?

[TeeJay]

You people are from CSN right? welcome :)

I recognise 3 or 4 of the newcomers in this thread from UKT and probably their first and last posts here, so not quite right.

I think the shield should be kept in since leagues/cups/tourneys won't allow it fixed or not. So let the current cs community enjoy the shield.

I also think that jumping should be removed from cs:s, after all italy has been remade with steps where jumps once were, may as well continue the trend with other maps and finish the 'bunnyhopping fix'.

[Raxxman]

I'd like to see shielders move slower

Right now they just burn around like rampent bunnies. If you could actually get past them 1 on 1 then it would be worth while.

[cireland]

I voted for remove the shield and I will explain why here.

Shields are never or very rarely used in Clan Wars, or PCW's, and on the occasions you find people with them on a public server they get abuse for using it.

Who mainly uses shields,

Simply people that are not good at CS, the "nubs" the "n00bs" and in all fairness why do you use one, cos you keep dying cos your crap eh ?
So if you don't have the shield in the game it may make some of the people that actually cannot play CS to save there life go back and find a beginners server and make all our CS life's a lot better :)


So I say GET RID OF IT!!!!!

Thanks :angel:

[-JeZ-]

Right, I've got to get something off my chest to start off with. NOT ALL CS PLAYERS PLAY COMPETITVELY!! IMO it's the height of arrogance to think that the competitve niche should delegate to the rest of the community.

Ok, rant over :) I used to play competitively and one thing to remeber is this: The CT's have to defuse the bomb / rescue the hostages. A shielder is invulnerable if he's in a corner but once they have to move to defuse the bomb / rescue the hossies then it's an entirely different story.

Think about it. With DE maps currently all you have to do is look at the bomb and click and hold the use key, then you can look away and turn to face elsewhere while you are defusing, this way the sheidlers have the advantage of being invincible as they can move the shield to block while they defuse. If they adjust the game in CS:S so that you have to look at the display to defuse it takes away that advantage and makes the shielder vulnerable.

I've never had a problem with shielders (apart from the vent campers in Assault but that's not often used as a match map) since if you use your brain you can always counter the use of the shield with good tactics and a few nades.

DISCLAIMER: I understand that playing against an entire team of shielders becomes very defficult / neigh on impossible.

[b0sH]

Nothing to do with arrogance about competitive CS. Fact is that without competitive cs you would take away all sponsers, famous teams and possibility of making it into more than just a game. Therefore you could also take away the reason for CS being made better. Without the likes of the CPL and the various websites that report on CS there's not a chance in hell that it would be as succesful as we see it today.

Also why shouldn't the best players who by description know how to play the game better than any1 else help to decide what should be changed. As long as they act in a manner that isnt just self preserving it can only push the game fwd.

People dont complain about all changes, allowing the choice of X Hair, improving the auto snipers and things like the friends system are all improvements to CS as a whole. the shield however is to open to abuse and should be weakened considerably, made far more expensive or removed all together to avoid adding annoyance to CS.

[cireland]

-JeZ-

In reply to your post,


I have never seen this happen on a server I have been on because generally they have the shield still cack themsevles and normally back away into a corner of the map, like i said it is mainly the people that cannot play CS that use it.

IMO I would rather have another player watching over me while defusing the bomb , than using a lame shield with so many bugs in , it might as well not be there.

[^Thomas^]

I think it should be like this :
1) Keep shield and make it more balanced
2) Remove shield and make some 1.5 fans happy :)

I agree.

Better balance!

[Tr0n]

OR take it out and make 90% of CS players happy.

[cireland]

As I cannot edit my post for some reason ?!?!? I will say b0sH hit the nail on the head

[Maxi]

As I cannot edit my post for some reason ?!?!? I will say b0sH hit the nail on the head


15min editing limit.

And I say keep the sheild, it's not that hard to take it off a server. That way everyones happy.

[Mr-Fusion]

Nothing to do with arrogance about competitive CS. Fact is that without competitive cs you would take away all sponsers, famous teams and possibility of making it into more than just a game. Therefore you could also take away the reason for CS being made better. Without the likes of the CPL and the various websites that report on CS there's not a chance in hell that it would be as succesful as we see it today.
Take away CPL, CAL and every other professional league and i guarantee CS will still be the most played FPS on the planet. Games generate their own popularity, not outside sources.

First comes the game, then it becomes popular, then comes the sponges. Then the sponges claim the game would be nothing without them. False.

[Rupertvdb]

i played cs for years from old old beta days and always wondered what a sheild would do to the game. Since then i stopped playing for a couple of years, now i'm getting back into it. The shield is a good idea as an option, if people want to include it on their servers then that should be fine, it's a valid addition and you might as well have it as an option.

However i believe the majority of servers should have it turned off as an option because (mainly in pub servers) you can't stop jackasses from abusing the help it can give.

This post sucked, i sound like i'm foreign, anyways, keep the shield it is good for LAN or private servers where people can be reasonable with such things.

[-JeZ-]

Nothing to do with arrogance about competitive CS. Fact is that without competitive cs you would take away all sponsers, famous teams and possibility of making it into more than just a game. Therefore you could also take away the reason for CS being made better. Without the likes of the CPL and the various websites that report on CS there's not a chance in hell that it would be as succesful as we see it today.

Also why shouldn't the best players who by description know how to play the game better than any1 else help to decide what should be changed. As long as they act in a manner that isnt just self preserving it can only push the game fwd.

People dont complain about all changes, allowing the choice of X Hair, improving the auto snipers and things like the friends system are all improvements to CS as a whole. the shield however is to open to abuse and should be weakened considerably, made far more expensive or removed all together to avoid adding annoyance to CS.

Thanks for not flaming m8 :thumbs: While I agree that the competitive scene in CS has done a lot to take us closer to the day when gaming becomes a viable profession I do think that letting one group (admittedly the biggest) of players change the game for everyone is wrong. Making the game more accessable to the nubs would be one of VALVe's first priorities simply becuase it makes them more money. Think about it from a nub point of view. When they are cowering behind their shields they are learning the game and will eventually throw the thing away when they get more experiance.

[cireland]

Think about it from a nub point of view. When they are cowering behind their shields they are learning the game and will eventually throw the thing away when they get more experiance.

See I disagree with that comment, They will not learn a thing hiding behind a shield in the corner of a map. how they will learn is by when they die watching over players, and by going to find a server were A the talent is not as good or B Going to find a beginners servers to learn the basics
If they are using the Shield it is because they are getting killed to many times, it is really as simple as that, and as that would be the case then they should move on to another server like i said above.

[b0sH]

"Take away CPL, CAL and every other professional league and i guarantee CS will still be the most played FPS on the planet. Games generate their own popularity, not outside sources."

Your probably right but without these "sponges" I doubt CS would be with us still in the manner it is today. You cannott continue to make it easier for new players to pick it up and dominate it or you take away the healthy competition that exists today. The shield in general is not a skilled weapon, it simply requires a small ammount of aim and timing. The awp also has been made so that the better players can no longer dominate an area with it like in previous versions, watching the really skilled awpers was great to view and many of the maps have been made and designed with the old awp in mind.
If people want a CS that is a public only game and that organisations like the CPL and ESWC stop supporting then continue making the changes to make the game easier to pick up. However the people who make money from playing it, the likes of SK, NoA + others will simply move to the next game, just look back at where the players came from in the first place, people like Xenon, DarK, fisker etc are all old skool Quake players. A CS community with a spectator friendly and healthy competitive scene will develop in a far more positive way than a scene that is based on public play. Would hate to see it take the same kind of road as Quake 3.

[Mr-Fusion]

The addition of the shield added another layer of depth to enemy encounters.

Being the most popular FPS on the planet, did CS really need this addition? In short, no. I'm certain new players who join a server and get smacked around would find a certain level of satisfaction in being able to repel all oncoming bullet attacks using the shield.

Does the shield benefit gameplay? Like i said, it adds another layer to the gameplay, not neccesarily a benefit.

Example:
2 players face eachother. A very skilled player and a less skilled player. The very skilled player will win 8 times out of 10.

When the encounter changes from a skilled player with a rifle vs a less skilled player with a shield. Suddenly the less skilled player is given a pseudo-advantage. The skilled player feels cheated and robbed that they are denied the kill by this invincible shield. It becomes a symbol of frustration and annoyance as the skilled player just wants to bring about the inevitable, their victory.

Does it slow down the game? I don't think it slows down the game nearly as much as guys camping at T spawn on de_dust with AWPs. Those kind of campers are far more detrimental to the gameplay on that specific map. But it definitely can bring the pace down a little.

So there's my view on it. Should it be removed? I think it should be nerfed so it requires a lot more skill to use. It shouldn't be a refuge for the new player like it is today. Give the shield health once the health is 0 , bullets can penetrate but don't do as much damage as on raw flesh, or make it so you can shoot their feet when standing up, or make smoke grenades fog up their eye slot for 20 seconds, or just remove it completely.....

[b0sH]

^^ Very nice explanation.

[Mur]

If it really has improved hitboxes, so you can shoot the feet etc, keep it!

If it still has the same crappy hitboxes, please remove it :)

[simps-chan]

It will be much better for the whole gameplay idea to remove it imo, the shield is a newbie tool, and is just annoying... plz remove it, give skill a chance. Lately Valve has made changes to the game to be more newbie simpathetic, so they can attract new buyers I belive, It's just not fair for us (players since 1.3 or so) to encounter newbies with shields, just annoying. This is a golden opportunity for us to get rid of those annoying things, and to make our opinion count.

Besides, if they've improved the shield as they say, it's a possibility that major championships (such as CPL) approve the use of it, and that would change the whole concept of the game, even for the pro playing.
The game was really addictive at first, and the shield came just to bother us, it is not a fair equipment.

[Smittins]

For the love of christ remove the shield

[GraFF]

if theres a option in the server config to turn on/off ?

remove shield or allow to switch :]

[Cole]

Make the window shootable through. That way u can just shoot through the window ^_^.

[Charru]

I think it should be removed. It's quite useless since many servers block it and anyway it makes the gamespeed lower and that's why it isn't really a good part of COUNTER-STRIKE which has in my opinion a quite fast gamespeed.

[recky987]

He asked if it should be removed or kept but he didn't say what he was going to do to make it acceptable. Can't vote until i see that

[Icehat]

keep it, but make it better...

[-JeZ-]

If they keep it, then that should make the higher powerd guns cause cracks in the window, making it useless.

[Gunner]

Make the window shootable through. That way u can just shoot through the window ^_^.

A trained monkey could shoot through that visor.

[IchI]

The sheild problem is simple.

1. Get rid of the sheild compeltely.

2. When you have the sheild you can not buy armor, also when u reload or put your sheild back when its not up infront of you give make the sheild = 0. Basiclly bullets hit the character as stand when they have the sheild. And none of the dodge reg bullshite.

[Th00mz]

The shield is my only chance against the AWM :upstare:

[Gorgon]

I love shield Its so funny.

[NeW-DeAl]

i think shield dont have any meaning in cs. you cant use it in any competitions and i dont think its good to keep it, only for the shake of some noobs on public who wants to make the T's crazy. -sry 4 my English, im noob ^^, but hope u understood it-

[InE]

Valve,you have better and better ideas.The modifications with the awp,the crosshair color,size,and now you ask us about the shield.I think shield is totally bad to the game and to the community too.If somebody buy a shield, everybody shout with him.Shield makes many problems.Shield have a big and unacceptable advantage to the CT team.The game is slower and unrealistic with shield.Move it out from CS:S.And I like the idea,that you ask the whole CS community about removing shield and everyone can vote.I think it is the most correct way.You can do it with every new idea.And I would be happier :)

InE

[flo_Orian]

The shield should be restricted to cs_ maps. Fine solution imo :]

[Edcrab]

Like everyone else I've played with and against the shield, so I'm pretty ambivalent. I've heard so many glib explanations regarding tactics, and I'd argue that a lone shielder is fodder but a shield-wielding player escorted by other team members is a very potent, perhaps even overpowered force, especially in de_ maps; as said, the defensive role is far too magnified.

I've always wondered if we could help fix the AWM/shield divide by allowing the so-called "noob cannon" to penetrate the shield to some extent.

[h4vvok]

I think the shield is "fair" but it does leave a gap in the Terrorist and Counterterrorist balance...Terrorist should get Molotov Cocktail(was to be implemented in CZ I think but then changed developers?)...Molotov could perhaps set fire to the shield, making it a threat to the user rather than something of aide

[kmn]

remove it.
thanks for the poll valve.

[Mayhem]

Grrrr....most people are think of the shield in it's current state, what you gotta remember is that in CS:Source you'll most likely be able to shoot any limbs like legs, feet and arms that will be sticking out. This will make the shield a lot less effective while still providing a decent amount of cover. Sod the molotovs, that should make it balanced enough as it is!!

[Sneez0r]

i specially signed up for this!

i'd say : remove the shield, it has no tactical role in counter-strike, most people use it for camping, laming and pissing about. It slows the game down a lot, and it makes the game unbalanced. They just cover themself with the shield, run towards you, you empty you magazine, and they shoot you in the head. Maybe when the hitboxes are better it will be okay.. but in 1.6 the shield is a joke, bugged as hell!

[DanceMag]

I don't understnad why everyone is saying it "balances the game". The most played mode in cs is defusal maps, so thats what i will take for my explanation. Terrorists have the advantadge of the galil and the AK, which are cheaper than the CT's colt and famas. Whereas CT have the famas and the Colt, which are more expensive but a bit better. Both teams are allowed awps, deagles, mp5, and usp, which are the main used guns. How can one team allowed a sheild, the DEFENDING TEAM, be classed as balancing? The T team do have an advantage because they have cheaper weaponary, but that is instantly negated by the fact that the CT side is in defensive positions!! Remove hte shield, how does it balance the game? and i will also voice as many others that, if u do HAVE to keep it, make it selectable 0/1 on servers :P

ps. btw guy who said SK|SpawN doesnt play CAL, yeah thats because CAL is American, and he is Swedish, and alos CAL stands for Cyberathelite Amateur League, whereas SpawN plays in CPL which is Cyberathelite Proffesional League. The Whole CS community doesn't revolve around the American community ya' know?

[hegele]

If people still think its not even then give the T's some multive cocktails. That would own the crap out of the sheilds.

[KingPing_NOR]

With the better hitzones with source(i think) why not just make it possible to shot through the window? That way they cant just stand still taunting the Ts.

KEEP THE SHIELDS!

[alehm]

I think we should keep the sheild but Terrorist get to buy 2 HE grenades.

[pixartist]

keep of course

[DanceMag]

alehm, yeah that would balance it... :/ not

[CrazyHarij]

****ing remove it, aight?

[FoxDie]

If they leave it in, they need to make it a little more realistic. I mean, after a certain amount of rounds hit it, it should be penetrated. And caliber should make a difference also. I mean, a 7.62X39mm would tear through that shield any day of the week :P

[Ansur]

On the one hand I'd say 'leave it in', though the major leagues (sa. ESL) won't allow the shield to be used, so there's no point in keeping it in the game.

So one could say 'make it more balanced', but that would be a hard thing to do I think. Say the shield has 1000HP; it would take x AK47 bullets to be 'destroyed' or y AWP shots. But in situations like italy, where you need to run through a long passage, you'd be dead anyway.

[Alsi]

The reason, why so many leagues don't use the shield is because it is a living bug.

If they fix it properly, it may be inlcluded :)

LEAVE THE SHIELD IN *screeeeeeeaaaaaaam*

[h4vvok]

Give terros a better gun or something to replace the god awful galili...molotov cocktails would have been a much better item in my opinion, you could throw and hit a shielder and have damage overtime...also maybe could cost less than a nade but be more effective in a smaller damage radius, like explode on impact blah blah blah

[Kadayi]

The problem with the shield comes when it is over used, and you end up with every CT running around with one. The solution is to restrict the number permissible. A good T team should be able to handle 1 Shield user.

[3L_GRINGO]

I Can see why the "uk terrorists" dont like shields ! Why don´t you ask the "uk Ct´s" ? lol :/
Actually im joking. I am against the use of shields, but it doesn´t really bother me much as i play in some prety competetive servers that don´t allow shields, camping, using map bugs, and that limit the number of awp´s per team. what i mean is if it bothers you as much as it does me try another server !

[3L_GRINGO]

Yup ! 2 HE nades is not a bad idea at all for T´s !

[disruptioN_]

Shield is a joke.

[palotO]

hey guys... just one rule : only one CT can carry the shield ... its not a good idea ? =/ so u can warning a rush quickly

[OCybrManO]

Well, combine the new frag grenades in CS:CZ that do 50% more damage and have a 50% larger damage radius with people that run slower than normal because they are holding a huge metal plate... and you get some dead shield users.

[Crusader]

gives a MASSIVE advantage to CTs. Imgine 5 players with shields. Unhittable with any gun. Pro gamers or decent gamers that have pistol aim that is second to none. They just have to sit there and stop the Ts coming close, and if they see an oppertunity, easy kill followed by instant protection from anyone trying to shoot back at you. Silly? I'd say so.




Or you could just throw grenades at the tightly packed group of slow moving targets with poor weaponry...

[pinkerton]

Alright. IT has been forever since I have done any gaming AT all. Close to a year. I quit playing when 1.6 came out because is was shitty and boreing, and I was(and still am) more interested in guitar. Schoole had just started, I didnt have time for everything, so I just kind of quit. Then I heard about CS source and thought that it was kind of a idea. then when I read no shield, I decided that I would indeed play it.

Now, for CS:S, I would say leave it alone. Just keep the game as close to a 1.5/1.6 gameplay as you can.

However, for CS2 I would like to see a charater class type thing, with limits like 1-2 snipers. different limits for different levels, and this would bring weapons similar to the shotguns and submachine guns more into the mainstream.