On police 'brutality' towards protesters.

[15357]

Frequently Asked "Questions"

-"OMG! That riot cop hit a protester! Brutality!"

Perhaps it had something to do with this:
http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1304_photo.gif

-"But in that clip/picture the protesters were being non-violent."

Gee. Hey, did you know that peaceful protests only have unarmed 'watcher' police officers? To make sure that no-one gets hurt? Combat "Riot" Police are only called to the scene when they are needed (or the group has a history of violence). They only forcibly dissolve illegal protests! Shocking, isn't it? But of course, in that obviously biased video that I venture to call propaganda, the officers there to make sure that violence doesn't happen are evil oppressive pigs!

-"The issue was really important."

That justifies breaking the law? Inciting socio-disorder? Blocking traffic?

-"Protesting is a democratic right!"

Correction! Protesting/striking is a right only when it's in the boundaries of the law! But, protesters are above the law, right? Becuase anti-war or the dam is sooooo important, right?

-"you're a fascist!"

So?

-"They were peaceful, but the cops attacked first, causing them to retaliate!"

Wow. So, they somehow chimerically conjured up those 'defensive tools' to use against the police? And wait, how did the protesters retaliate if they were peaceful? Retaliation in itself is not peaceful.

-"They broke his arm!"

They broke his head!
http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1287_photo.gif

-"The laws couldn't supprot the minoritiees, they had no choice."

Welcome to democracy. A system in which the majorities interests are more valued than the minorities.

-"You're brainwashed!"

And your almost diabolically delusional exclamation that is devoid of a basis somehow invalidates everything I say?

-"The protesters got hurt more, and the police have protection
+ training."

Let's beat them up into a pulp like a pinata because they have protection? Let's not arrest criminals because they don't have helmets?

-"The police knew what they were facing, but the protesters didn't."

:laugh: The protesters must have been retards that didn't even know the consequences for engaging in criminal activities engendering social disorder, right?

------------------


There. I've done a few arguements. Let's have a discussion on this.

[Dog--]

Finally a rant that makes sense by numbers.

I agree with it all!

[6Three]

Becuase anti-war or the dam is sooooo important, right?


Yeah, it is.

[Potemkin]

Is that a broken record I hear?

[Absinthe]

Numbers, tell me what point you're trying to make with this.

[Dog--]

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=111585

He probably wanted to escelate (sp?) the arguement some more :D

[DeusExMachina]

He could've easily done that in the thread. Now he just wants people to bite him.

[Absinthe]

I just want him to put, in concise terms, what his point is.

Is it that protestors are evil?
OR
That protesting is inherently bad?
OR
That some protestor step over the line and become legitimate threats?

I'd like to know where he's trying to go with this. Because Numbers says a lot of questionable things, and it would be very easy to hop on an assumption and rip him apart.

[15357]

My point is that the so called police brutality in protests is at the very least mostly not due to the evil pigs wanting to beat people up. I think my post was clear....

Yeah, it is.

Enough to commit crimes?

He could've easily done that in the thread. Now he just wants people to bite him.

I do not understand you.

[Dog--]

He could've easily done that in the thread. Now he just wants people to bite him.
I do not understand you.


He's calling you an attention whore..


FIGHT!

[DeusExMachina]

No, I'm calling him an instigator. It seems he wants to start things like this even though he definitely knows what most peoples responses are going to be. It's like preaching to the anti-choir...or something.

[15357]

No, I'm calling him an instigator. It seems he wants to start things like this even though he definitely knows what most peoples responses are going to be. It's like preaching to the anti-choir...or something.

I'm sorry, but did you even read my post?

[ktimekiller]

15357, some people, cannot be taught.

[6Three]

I've just come to a startling conclusion: 15257 is a troll.

[Absinthe]

My point is that the so called police brutality in protests is at the very least mostly not due to the evil pigs wanting to beat people up. I think my post was clear....

What is it due to? Evil protestors?

[15357]

What is it due to? Evil protestors?

Well, somewhat. First of all, if they were protesting enough to bring riot police to the scene, somethings gone wrong.

[CyberPitz]

Yeah, I hate looking at shit and it showing how the protesters did NOTHING wrong, even when the truth is they provoked it all.

[Revisedsoul]

it goes both ways

[MiccyNarc]

it goes both ways

DING DING DING! We have a winnar!

[DietSoap]

What I take from it is that there's always people from both sides that are wrong, no ideal is ever perfect. There is no pure right or pure wrong, a lot of people into politics haven't realized this yet.

[-Psy-]

What I take from it is that there's always people from both sides that are wrong, no ideal is ever perfect. There is no pure right or pure wrong, a lot of people into politics haven't realized this yet.

Right on the money!

[MiccyNarc]

What I take from it is that there's always people from both sides that are wrong, no ideal is ever perfect. There is no pure right or pure wrong, a lot of people into politics haven't realized this yet.

Libertarians are always right. ^_^

[Tyguy]

When i was in school, riot police came and shot at crowds with paintballs, and it worked

[Steven]

Becuase anti-war or the dam is sooooo important, right?
Trying to stop a war is'nt worth it?
I've just come to a startling conclusion: 15257 is a troll.
15257

[CptStern]

yes Numbers those poor policemen are victems of protestor brutality

http://www.nothingtoxic.com/media/1151234890/Korean_Police_Brutality

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KWrh3A7TzOA

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1896336681061668836&q=korean&hl=en

[Solaris]

Omg, the stuff thoose cops are doing.

I'd flame em anyday.

[Korgoth]

its almost as if he is protesting against protesting! Quick, someone gas him and beat the **** out of em'. :p

[CptStern]

dont forget to step on his face, bash his head in with a baton, kick him in the ribs while he's in the fetal position and then arrest him for assaulting a police officer ...more beatings at jailhouse ftw

[Hectic Glenn]

Numbers tell me this then? Watching those videos, there are guys sitting on the floor and they drag the people behind their shields and beat them to death, for sitting there. There are people in front of them waving a flag and the police officer tries to behead him with a shield's edge. There are COUNTLESS people laying on the floor bleeding to death, with collapsed lungs and all sorts and they are STILL kicking them. Theres one clip where they are picking up a guy for medical care and an officer clubs him on the head as they pick him up. You support the control methods you support it all. I can't understand you...sorry.

[tehsolace]

The police are our friends... in america...

[15357]

yes Numbers those poor policemen are victems of protestor brutality

http://www.nothingtoxic.com/media/1151234890/Korean_Police_Brutality

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KWrh3A7TzOA

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1896336681061668836&q=korean&hl=en

http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1300_photo.gif

http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1323_photo.gif

http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1335_photo.gif

mms://ohmyvod.ohmynews.com/ohmytv/vo...1_1[1].wmv -Video

IN ANY OTHER NATION, THEY WOULD HAVE SHOT THEM WITH LIVE FIRE. Shield bashing < shooting

Like this: http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/4343/b179fd.jpg


http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1881_photo.gif
-Getting arrested by Military Police Corps. You'll notice that the protester is not getting beaten up.

http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1328_photo.gif

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/333/n2o121113206211142984492ze9.jpg

http://img.news.yahoo.co.kr/picture/80/20060720/8020060720_25656482.JPG

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9471/n2o121123334311144435800kj6.jpg

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/7369/n2o121189173351145014636dq6.jpg

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/1439/n2o1211891733151145014639sw5.jpg


If I ever get conscripted into the ROKCP corps, I'd defend myself, too. WHEN YOU USE ****ING FIREBOMBS AT POLICE, YOU DO NOT DESERVE TO BE A HUMAN ****ING BEING!


http://kr.img.n2o.yahoo.com/yhi/nbbs/n2o2006/08/04/n2o_1119_170223_1?1156338122.jpg What happens in almost all the cases of 'brutality'.




http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/5459/n2o141232769411155744071eh5.jpg
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6728/n2o141232769441155744071xm9.jpg
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9871/n2o141232769451155744071mt1.jpg

BRUTALITY! :rolleyes:


http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/2338/n2o121253922811155880584yi2.jpg



****em. ****em all.

[Solaris]

Numbers, if you notice the vids Stern posted. We can quite see the police officers were using way to much force, excessive to a lethal degree. When a suspect is on the ground bleeding from serious injury, hitting him with your sheild kicking and punching him is highly unjustifiable by the police.

No matter what the provocation the police are NEVER justified to do that?
Now, if the police are doing that, to peaceful people, the next time, these peaceful people are going to bring things to defend themselves. I support them, thoose police officers are plain evil and need a good flaming imo.

[CptStern]

Numbers: how does that in any way justify police brutality in the videos I posted? please explain because I'd really like to understand how you can be so completely brainwashed that you cant see the videos for what they are: excessive police brutality. Are you saying those civilians lying on the floor covering their heads while police kick them in the faces deserved it?

you're either an idiot, a fool or are so brainwashed that you cant recognise injustice when you see it ...I suspect it's a little of all 3

[15357]

http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/6093/n2o111917022311156338122jg0.jpg

Numbers: how does that in any way justify police brutality in the videos I posted? please explain because I'd really like to understand how you can be so completely brainwashed that you cant see the videos for what they are: excessive police brutality. Are you saying those civilians lying on the floor covering their heads while police kick them in the faces deserved it?

you're either an idiot, a fool or are so brainwashed that you cant recognise injustice when you see it ...I suspect it's a little of all 3

Yeah, police aren't even human beings and can be burned to death, but the protesters are so ****ing little angels that should be allowed to keep hitting people. You know what? YOu commie bastard, you are so brainwashed by anarchistic and liberal propaganda that you can't even recognize violent protesting.

[tehsolace]

Riot police in America do not use lethal weaponary. They use rubber bullets and bean bag shotguns and various other technologies. Why do you think we invented these things?

I believe the Korean police were just a bunch of fast-recruited, non-trained bunch of people, which resulted in their own riot-like behavior. If they were trained properly, they wouldn't of been so amazingly brutal. Nothing justifies such behavior... its horrible for 10 people to beat on one person who is crouching in fear.

[Solaris]

So?

They had a man holding a flag and probably killed him with a sheild.

[CptStern]

lol! you're soooo blind it's not even funny ...how old are you btw? have you ever been to a protest? in fact have you ever left your cushy little world and talked to some of the people who protest? or are you going solely by what your government tells you?

btw where are you getting these images? why are they hosted on imageshack? why not provide the original link?


Numbers why do you refuse to comment of the videos I posted ..I'd really like to hear you trying to justify the police's use of force

[Solaris]

That poor cop though :( Probably deserves it but still...
And lol at that contraption on wheels they built.

[15357]

Of course I have, didn't I tell you? 2004 Busan, APEC. They were a damn lynch mob.

btw where are you getting these images? why are they hosted on imageshack? why not provide the original link?

Yeah, you can't read korean though...

I believe the Korean police were just a bunch of fast-recruited, non-trained bunch of people, which resulted in their own riot-like behavior. If they were trained properly, they wouldn't of been so amazingly brutal. Nothing justifies such behavior... its horrible for 10 people to beat on one person who is crouching in fear.

Amazingly brutal my ass. They are possibly the most disciplined police force iun the world. They don''t even use tear gas at the mobs commie students.

So?

They had a man holding a flag and probably killed him with a sheild.

He's not dead. Just a broken jaw. In fact, except for that farmer who fell down and died, no protester has been killed since 1987. The police on the other hand......



Of course. http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9471/n2o121123334311144435800kj6.jpg

It's wrong to hit someone with 10 people.

[CptStern]

still interested in your source

so are you going to comment on the videos I posted or will you ignore that along with the other dozen or so points you've ignored? And no dont use the idiotic defense that in busan they used flame throwers etc ...the videos clearly show flame-throwerless protestors being beaten ...in fact in many of the cases the police attack was completely unprovoked

again have you ever been to a protest? have you ever witnessed first hand what goes on? or are you getting everything you know from what the government spoonfeeds you?

[15357]

I commented on them. "I'd have done the same thing and defended myself."

News sites, blogs, my friend's dad who's a CP, ect.

[15357]

And why won't you comment on my vid?

mms://ohmyvod.ohmynews.com/ohmytv/vo...1_1[1].wmv

[CptStern]

I commented on them. "I'd have done the same thing and defended myself."

the videos clearly show the police outnumbered the protestors and also that the protestors were no threat at the time they were being beaten

News sites,

post them please

blogs,

post it please

my friend's dad who's a CP, ect.

post them please


btw you answered nothing ..saying you'd do the same does absolutely nothing in justifying police brutality ..again the protestors didnt have lethal weapons, they didnt have flamethrowers yet you defend police beating the living shit out of them for what reason exactly?


stop pussy footing around the issue and answer directly: in the 3 videos I posted how do you justify police brutality?



And why won't you comment on my vid?

no, no I'm not falling for that old trick ...I asked first

but I will indulge you just this once ..thevideo doesnt work for me

now it's your turn ...I'm waiting

[tehsolace]

Amazingly brutal my ass. They are possibly the most disciplined police force iun the world. They don''t even use tear gas at the mobs commie students.

What I saw was not disciplined... it was riot-like behavior and senseless attacking on anyone not wearing a uniform. Most of the beatings I saw were on people who were RUNNING or crouching in fear...

[tehsolace]

And why won't you comment on my vid?

mms://ohmyvod.ohmynews.com/ohmytv/vo...1_1[1].wmv

doesn't work for me...

[15357]

lethal weapons

Have you ever gotten hit by a iron pipe? Wouldn't that be classified as a lethal weapon? And wait, did that protester in the pic die? Of courese not.

www.chosun.com
http://kr.news.yahoo.com/
www.donga.com
http://kr.blog.yahoo.com/sea4season/295.html
http://kr.blog.yahoo.com/imnews86/1079852.html

http://img.news.yahoo.co.kr/picture/47/20051228/4720051228_21813211.jpg

They don't only hit police: http://img.news.yahoo.co.kr/picture/80/20060817/8020060817_26524447.jpg

[Solaris]

So? Even if thoose protestors were fighting the police. It doesnt justify what they were doing. The police were in the wrong even if that guy they beat to near-death had been hitting them. As they are the police and are supposed to control themselves.

[tehsolace]

the police are supposed to have resources available to them to help keep control AND minimize harm to the people. even if they didnt have technologies such as rubber bullets and bean bags and don't use tear gas to control crowds, a simple firehose can take care of most any riot situation.

the police used nothing productive in the videos...they simply started beating up everyone with their metal shields. how is that control or helpful?

[15357]

doesn't work for me...

mms://ohmyvod.ohmynews.com/ohmytv/vod/200/rofmay_82701_1[1].wmv



So? Even if thoose protestors were fighting the police. It doesnt justify what they were doing. The police were in the wrong even if that guy they beat to near-death had been hitting them. As they are the police and are supposed to control themselves.

Correction! THEY WERE BEATING THE POLICE INTO A PULP!

WEE! BURN 'EM ALL!

http://sig.megapass.net/club/home1/archives/ALBUM/1374_photo.gif

[CptStern]

the video I posted clearly showed that police didnt care if the protestors were armed or not ..in fact they didnt care if they were women or men

again Numbers you havent answered anything ..why do you refuse to comment of the videos I posted?

[15357]

btw, I have to sleep now. 1 am.

THE THING WAS WHOLLY JUSTIFIED! IRON PIPE = DEFENCE!

[CptStern]

you didnt watch the videos ..the people writhing on the floor getting stomped on by police officers were not carrying pipes. The woman who is covering her head while being kicked by 2 police officers is clearly NOT armed ..even if she were armed with a lead pipe how could anyone believe she's a threat to 2 much largers/well protected police officers?

the protestor who gets a shield slammed into his face doesnt have an iron pipe, he's carrying a flag and isnt doing anything wrong when he's assaulted by police ..but nice attempt at blindsiding the issue

again Numbers you havent answered anything ..and dont use sleep as an excuse, I'm not giving up till you give me a detailed answer

[Angry Lawyer]

Christ almighty, this place is actually giving me cancer.

Woo, welcome to TRYING TO PROVE A POINT. Guess what - Numbers' source is biased towards the police. Stern's source is biased towards the protestors.

CAN ANYONE SEE A PATTERN HERE? GUESS WHAT, YOU CAN'T JUSTIFY BRUTALITY ON EITHER SIDE!

-Angry Lawyer

[CptStern]

I think that's the point people have been making since the very start of this thread (as well as Numberessess' last thread on this same issue)

[DeusExMachina]

So? Even if thoose protestors were fighting the police. It doesnt justify what they were doing. The police were in the wrong even if that guy they beat to near-death had been hitting them. As they are the police and are supposed to control themselves.

What the **** are you talking about? Are you actually saying police have no right to defend themselves against attack? Are you ****ing insane?

Jesus Christ, you and Numbers are going to give me a tumor.

[Angry Lawyer]

I think that's the point people have been making since the very start of this thread (as well as Numberessess' last thread on this same issue)

Conversely, I believe the thread was created to the number of people saying "Oh my god those cops should be killed" any time that protesting is mentioned.

-Angry Lawyer

[CptStern]

Numbers posted it in direct response to this thread (http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=111585) ..he even has some statements in this thread (first post) that are very similiar to what I said in the last thread

[Angry Lawyer]

But it's a build up from a long time of what I've mentioned, that thread's likely a catalyst.

A large number of people here seem to think that riot police are subhuman. Guess what - they're people, just like the protestors. Stop tarbrushing them all as the same, before I get an air pocket in my bloodstream.

-Angry Lawyer

[Remus]

What the **** are you talking about? Are you actually saying police have no right to defend themselves against attack? Are you ****ing insane?

No, Solaris is saying that after the police have caught a protester and he is no longer a threat they shouldn't beat the crap out of him for revenge, they should have some self control.

PS: after watching the videos and seeing all the pictures I've come to the conclusion that both sides are equally brutal:| .

[CptStern]

dood you gotta relax, nothing is worh an airpocket

anyways, that last thread was specifically about police brutality ..so it's understandable there were more than a few "omg the pigs are bastards" comments ..this thread is more than just that ..Numbers leaves absolutely NO room for any other interpretation except that "Police are victems/protestors deserve beatings/imprisonment just because they're protesting ...nothing more ..to Numbers ALL protestors are equal ..which couldnt possibly be further from the truth

[Beerdude26]

I think that's the point people have been making since the very start of this thread (as well as Numberessess' last thread on this same issue)Then what are you still doing here, go back to politics and pwn some bigots, let numbers spam some more stuff in this thread :p

[Sulkdodds]

THIS THREAD IS STUPID.

Hey look, pictures of violent protestors!
Well hey, I've got videos of police violence which appear to contradict you!
Well I have pictures of protester violence that invalidates your evidence! There is no such thing as police brutality!
Rant, rave, rant, rave, can't climb the stairs, I'm the operator of a desktop calculator!

HEY GUESS WHAT THROWING RANDOM PIECES OF EVIDENCE AT EACH OTHER UNTIL THE COWS COME HOME, FIX A COFFEE, WATCH A MOVIE AND GO OUT FOR THE NIGHT DOES NOT PROVE YOUR OWN POINTS NOR DOES IT INVALIDATE ANY OF YOUR OPPONENT'S - UNLESS YOUR OPPONENT IS CLAIMING AN ABSOLUTE THAT CAN CLEARLY BE CONTRADICTED!

My point is that the so called police brutality in protests is at the very least mostly not due to the evil pigs wanting to beat people up.Do a comprehensive study. Look at every instance of civil disobedience/mass protest/brawling in the streets since the year 1900. Accurately ascertain the causes every time one breaks into violence, taking into account predmeditation, who struck first, the position of each 'side', the social background, etc. Do this for every riot turned violent and then collate all the data and draw your conclusions.

Oh, you're not going to do that. Well, okay, post some half-arsed reasoning and pictures of protesters beating people up, then tell us what you think!

Note that your wording, "evil pigs wanting to beat people up", implies to me that it encompasses also "evil government wanting to oppress people" and "evil pigs not prepared to let people speak freely" etc etc. Because, obviously, if the whole point of this thread was to tell us that this conversation -

(POLICE GUY: Hey, Chief. Protesters again.
POLICE CHIEF: I love blood and violence! I got a boner for murder! Let's get 'em!
POLICE GUY: Right on!)

- doesn't happen very often, then this thread is really a total waste of space.

Obviously protesters get out of control or are just generally bastards sometimes - as illustrated nicely by your friend and mine Danny "I'd flame em anyday" Solaris. Equally obviously, sometimes people in a position of power are wrong. Sometimes the police do treat people wrongly, do attack civilians who aren't threats and do go completely ****ing nutso on crowds of unarmed protesters.

This is to ignore the possibility that maybe, in some cases, attacking riot police and/or rioting is in some ways justified.

The reason people call you brainwashed, Solaris, is generally a reference to your general world view - I remember you once saying "authority should be obeyed because it's authority". From a practical please-don't-shoot-me standpoint, this is perhaps true, but not from any other.

Also because of this:

There's no difference [between rioters and protesters]It seems clear from your attitude that you think all forms of protest against an incumbent government are cardinal sin. God forbid anybody question authority. Gathering in the streets to wave placards is just as bad as tipping over cars in your book.

Riot police in America do not use lethal weaponary. They use rubber bullets and bean bag shotguns and various other technologies.Rubber bullets are not non-lethal.

[CptStern]

Then what are you still doing here, go back to politics and pwn some bigots, let numbers spam some more stuff in this thread :p


well someone's gotta counter Numberessess' fascist/totalitarian ways ..too much Fascism/totalitarianism makes Stern a sad panda (occasionally an angry punching panda)

[Beerdude26]

well someone's gotta counter Numberessess' fascist/totalitarian ways ..too much Fascism/totalitarianism makes Stern a sad panda (occasionally an angry punching panda)angry stern
is angry

Gotcha.

[CptStern]

angry stern
is angry

Gotcha.

ya but a nice simmering low flame angry ..not the I-crack-open-heads-and feast-on-the-exposed-goo type angry that Numbers seems to fall prey to

[Angry Lawyer]

Numbers was released into the ecosystem to counter the emerging threat of rebel-even-if-it-doesn't-make-sense that Solaris brings.

-Angry Lawyer

[Beerdude26]

Numbers was released into the ecosystem to counter the emerging threat of rebel-even-if-it-doesn't-make-sense that Solaris brings.

-Angry LawyerHawt. So what am I D:

[CptStern]

Numbers was released into the ecosystem to counter the emerging threat of rebel-even-if-it-doesn't-make-sense that Solaris brings.

-Angry Lawyer



number's puppy was killed by protestors ...and the protestors took pictures and mailed them to his house addressed to:

to: Patriotic guy
from: Evil Protestors
re: dead puppies = pwned

[KagePrototype]

THIS THREAD IS STUPID. ^
This thread is obviously going no where, serves no real purpose and shouldn't even be in this forum. Clos'd!

[Hectic Glenn]

These threads end up in bitter arguments and flaming. It's also an issue which has been gone over several times and it's becoming tiresome as there will never be a peace between members on it. Therefore i urge 15357 to cease making threads on this topic, and that Stern and Solaris do not persue it in other threads for the sakes of peace. I hope for your co-operation or further action may be taken, it would be better left like this. Merci beaucoup!